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Bel Grant
Posted: 20 August 2020 17:12:43(UTC)
#18

Joined: 22/07/2020(UTC)
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ANDREW FOSTER;126053 wrote:
]
Bel Grant;126040 wrote:


Besides, they charged me a fortune for my two other trades. How they can justify charging nearly £40 on two stocks when the price drop was not even a penny on either one by the following morning, is beyond me.



Let me be frank here.... CFD day trading is a mugs game and the odds are stacked against you. That's why 75-80 % of people lose money doing it.

But everyone thinks they are in the 20% that make a little. And a little is all they usually make.

The spreads, the fees, the "shaking the tree" to trigger stop losses.... it's all just to part you from your money. Bit by bit, little by little.

At some point people figure this out and stop doing it, hopefully not having lost too much. Then they turn to proper investing and start to think long term.

You ask how can they justify £40 for two trades..? The answer is simple. Because you and others are willing to pay it....


I didn't use a CFD, though on my Gold trade. I only bought the underlying asset at 1x leverage (no borrowed bank money to increase the trade investment). There was no contract for difference involved. I am well aware of leveraging risks and rarely use it. I would only ever 2x leverage maximum, and only when the market is pretty much a sure thing going in one direction or another. I have never blown up my account and would not be stupid enough to do that.

If I had leveraged this trade order by multiple times, I would have won hundreds not just a few quid.


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1 user thanked Bel Grant for this post.
ANDREW FOSTER on 20/08/2020(UTC)
andy mac
Posted: 20 August 2020 19:39:42(UTC)
#20

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Bel Grant;126076 wrote:
[

If I had leveraged this trade order by multiple times, I would have won hundreds not just a few quid.




I have to say the last sentence that you wrote quoted above says it all
i would have WON

To me that implies betting or gambling not investing
Smell the coffee
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2 users thanked andy mac for this post.
jacm on 23/08/2020(UTC), Logic Prophets on 25/08/2020(UTC)
mark spurrier
Posted: 23 August 2020 06:51:18(UTC)
#19

Joined: 17/01/2018(UTC)
Posts: 1,696

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Was thanked: 3322 time(s) in 1130 post(s)
Bel Grant;126076 wrote:
ANDREW FOSTER;126053 wrote:
]
Bel Grant;126040 wrote:


Besides, they charged me a fortune for my two other trades. How they can justify charging nearly £40 on two stocks when the price drop was not even a penny on either one by the following morning, is beyond me.



Let me be frank here.... CFD day trading is a mugs game and the odds are stacked against you. That's why 75-80 % of people lose money doing it.

But everyone thinks they are in the 20% that make a little. And a little is all they usually make.

The spreads, the fees, the "shaking the tree" to trigger stop losses.... it's all just to part you from your money. Bit by bit, little by little.

At some point people figure this out and stop doing it, hopefully not having lost too much. Then they turn to proper investing and start to think long term.

You ask how can they justify £40 for two trades..? The answer is simple. Because you and others are willing to pay it....


I didn't use a CFD, though on my Gold trade. I only bought the underlying asset at 1x leverage (no borrowed bank money to increase the trade investment). There was no contract for difference involved. I am well aware of leveraging risks and rarely use it. I would only ever 2x leverage maximum, and only when the market is pretty much a sure thing going in one direction or another. I have never blown up my account and would not be stupid enough to do that.

If I had leveraged this trade order by multiple times, I would have won hundreds not just a few quid.




I am lost

From the original post

"
So I transferred £500 margin across to them and bought a Gold CFD (1$) - just 1 unit."

This is a bookie not a broker. The gold CFD they have is on a 20:1 leverage and the lot size is variable.

What exactly did you try and trade? They ONLY trade CFD and SBs you can't buy the underlying ETF or Phys Gold

Is the commission flat or tiered. Commissions always look bad if you only buy 1

So this isn't an "online Brokerage" it is a bookie - brokers facilitate and place your instructions in a market. Bookies accept or reject your BET and are then the counterparty. The bookie cancelled your bet after they had confirmed acceptance?

Sorry but all I can read from this is that you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what you are doing.

BTW were your other bets making money when you demanded refunds?
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3 users thanked mark spurrier for this post.
jacm on 23/08/2020(UTC), mdss68 on 24/08/2020(UTC), Captain Slugwash on 24/08/2020(UTC)
Bel Grant
Posted: 24 August 2020 09:45:42(UTC)
#24

Joined: 22/07/2020(UTC)
Posts: 14

Was thanked: 6 time(s) in 6 post(s)
I dont think you understand.

The Gold trade I ordered was the amount for 1 unit at the order price of 1915 (the price of gold at the time). I did not ramp up the value of the trade by leveraging it by x2, x10 etc. which meant the value of the trade was multiple times what I was prepared to trade wit myself. My margin went into the trade, nothing more. So it was not a CFD in practice. The term CFD simply means Contract For Difference. That option exists on this platform, so it seems, but I did not use it. So yes, I was buying the underlying asset. In fact, in the order box, I did not even see an option to add leverage let alone reject it. The value of my trade was precisely for 1 x 1 unit, which came to just under £100. All of this was stated on my order form, which comes through once an order is placed by email, giving all the details of price, amount traded etc.

If you go on eToro, another brokerage, you can buy Gold at x1. You can also increase the value of the trade by adding leverage to it, which duplicates the number of units you trade with by the leveraged percentage without having to add more of your money. That way you profit more if the buy price goes up and lose more if the buy price drops.

Stop trying to make out that I don't know what I am doing. I know exactly what I am doing and I know exactly what I did .

Trading is not gambling if you have a good idea of what you are doing and why you are doing it. There is an element of risk to all trading and investing because profiting does not just depend on fundamentals, but on unknown factors as well. Even the best, professional traders lose out sometimes.

I am no longer contributing this topic.
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andy mac
Posted: 24 August 2020 11:02:31(UTC)
#28

Joined: 12/02/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,263

Thanks: 1052 times
Was thanked: 1299 time(s) in 633 post(s)
OP said
Stop trying to make out that I don't know what I am doing. I know exactly what I am doing and I know exactly what I did .

Trading is not gambling if you have a good idea of what you are doing and why you are doing it. There is an element of risk to all trading and investing because profiting does not just depend on fundamentals, but on unknown factors as well. Even the best, professional traders lose out sometimes.

I am no longer contributing this topic.
end

Firstly thank you for not contributing
You appear not to know what you were doing or who you were dealing with
Trading gambling hair splitting
move on
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Sibob
Posted: 24 August 2020 11:52:04(UTC)
#29

Joined: 19/12/2014(UTC)
Posts: 209
If he put the same amount of effort into an interesting stock trade it might be worth a read, or not!
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mark spurrier
Posted: 24 August 2020 13:14:48(UTC)
#25

Joined: 17/01/2018(UTC)
Posts: 1,696

Thanks: 178 times
Was thanked: 3322 time(s) in 1130 post(s)
Bel Grant;126499 wrote:
I dont think you understand.

The Gold trade I ordered was the amount for 1 unit at the order price of 1915 (the price of gold at the time). I did not ramp up the value of the trade by leveraging it by x2, x10 etc. which meant the value of the trade was multiple times what I was prepared to trade wit myself. My margin went into the trade, nothing more. So it was not a CFD in practice. The term CFD simply means Contract For Difference. That option exists on this platform, so it seems, but I did not use it. So yes, I was buying the underlying asset. In fact, in the order box, I did not even see an option to add leverage let alone reject it. The value of my trade was precisely for 1 x 1 unit, which came to just under £100. All of this was stated on my order form, which comes through once an order is placed by email, giving all the details of price, amount traded etc.

If you go on eToro, another brokerage, you can buy Gold at x1. You can also increase the value of the trade by adding leverage to it, which duplicates the number of units you trade with by the leveraged percentage without having to add more of your money. That way you profit more if the buy price goes up and lose more if the buy price drops.

Stop trying to make out that I don't know what I am doing. I know exactly what I am doing and I know exactly what I did .

Trading is not gambling if you have a good idea of what you are doing and why you are doing it. There is an element of risk to all trading and investing because profiting does not just depend on fundamentals, but on unknown factors as well. Even the best, professional traders lose out sometimes.

I am no longer contributing this topic.



So I transferred £500 margin across to them and bought a Gold CFD (1$) - just 1 unit."

That was your post not mine.
I think you are confusing the price for the CFD with the margin. All CFD are on margin........all of them. If a CFD wasn't on margin it would be a physical purchase. :)

1915 is the reference price you bought at from which the "difference" will be measured

If you have a brilliant scheme to buy $1915 assets for £500 that is the trick you should be sharing :)

Your comment re eToro relates to the ability to further leverage the bet and accentuate the gain of loss.

I think you have made the case. I don't think you have a scooby-doo what you are doing.
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Bel Grant
Posted: 24 August 2020 23:30:29(UTC)
#26

Joined: 22/07/2020(UTC)
Posts: 14

Was thanked: 6 time(s) in 6 post(s)
mark spurrier;126521 wrote:
Bel Grant;126499 wrote:
I dont think you understand.

The Gold trade I ordered was the amount for 1 unit at the order price of 1915 (the price of gold at the time). I did not ramp up the value of the trade by leveraging it by x2, x10 etc. which meant the value of the trade was multiple times what I was prepared to trade wit myself. My margin went into the trade, nothing more. So it was not a CFD in practice. The term CFD simply means Contract For Difference. That option exists on this platform, so it seems, but I did not use it. So yes, I was buying the underlying asset. In fact, in the order box, I did not even see an option to add leverage let alone reject it. The value of my trade was precisely for 1 x 1 unit, which came to just under £100. All of this was stated on my order form, which comes through once an order is placed by email, giving all the details of price, amount traded etc.

If you go on eToro, another brokerage, you can buy Gold at x1. You can also increase the value of the trade by adding leverage to it, which duplicates the number of units you trade with by the leveraged percentage without having to add more of your money. That way you profit more if the buy price goes up and lose more if the buy price drops.

Stop trying to make out that I don't know what I am doing. I know exactly what I am doing and I know exactly what I did .

Trading is not gambling if you have a good idea of what you are doing and why you are doing it. There is an element of risk to all trading and investing because profiting does not just depend on fundamentals, but on unknown factors as well. Even the best, professional traders lose out sometimes.

I am no longer contributing this topic.



So I transferred £500 margin across to them and bought a Gold CFD (1$) - just 1 unit."

That was your post not mine.
I think you are confusing the price for the CFD with the margin. All CFD are on margin........all of them. If a CFD wasn't on margin it would be a physical purchase. :)

1915 is the reference price you bought at from which the "difference" will be measured

If you have a brilliant scheme to buy $1915 assets for £500 that is the trick you should be sharing :)

Your comment re eToro relates to the ability to further leverage the bet and accentuate the gain of loss.

I think you have made the case. I don't think you have a scooby-doo what you are doing.


NO I don't think you know your arse from your elbow, you rude pr**k

Just because I got a terminology or two wrong doesn't mean the underlying transaction attempt was not as I described. I don't think a discussion at the brokerage took place whereby they said "oh, this woman has used the word margin instead of ..or she has bought 1 x something but didn't call it a CFD so we won't honour the trade.

Are you that much of a jerk that you believe someone should be refused service just because the seller decides they don't want to sell for no good reason, after specifically having a conversation with that same person to say they could buy that asset.

Are you going to the supermarket tomorrow and will ask the shop assistant. Can you sell me a bag of Kettle crisps. They say 'no we call them chips not crisps, so no we won't serve them to you?

The whole line of argument you are taking is ridiculous, patronising and shows what a totally misinformed jerk you are.

No, I haven't been trading long. I also profusely apologise to you personally if I have offended you by using a few terminologies inappropriately. It seems that is a terrible thing to happen. I hope you get over it and it hasn't caused you any lasting harm.

Frankly, you haven't a scooby doo idea of how to treat people. You obviously think kicking people whilst they are down is fun. Well, rock on mate. I hope you experience the same treatment when you go on a forum expecting some help and all you get is abuse.



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mdss68
Posted: 25 August 2020 06:55:50(UTC)
#27

Joined: 20/09/2018(UTC)
Posts: 1,975

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Bel Grant;126590 wrote:
mark spurrier;126521 wrote:
Bel Grant;126499 wrote:
I dont think you understand.



If you go on eToro, another brokerage, you can buy Gold at x1. You can also increase the value of the trade by adding leverage to it, which duplicates the number of units you trade with by the leveraged percentage without having to add more of your money. That way you profit more if the buy price goes up and lose more if the buy price drops.

Stop trying to make out that I don't know what I am doing. I know exactly what I am doing and I know exactly what I did .

Trading is not gambling if you have a good idea of what you are doing and why you are doing it. There is an element of risk to all trading and investing because profiting does not just depend on fundamentals, but on unknown factors as well. Even the best, professional traders lose out sometimes.

I am no longer contributing this topic.



So I transferred £500 margin across to them and bought a Gold CFD (1$) - just 1 unit."

That was your post not mine.
I think you are confusing the price for the CFD with the margin. All CFD are on margin........all of them. If a CFD wasn't on margin it would be a physical purchase. :)

1915 is the reference price you bought at from which the "difference" will be measured

If you have a brilliant scheme to buy $1915 assets for £500 that is the trick you should be sharing :)

Your comment re eToro relates to the ability to further leverage the bet and accentuate the gain of loss.

I think you have made the case. I don't think you have a scooby-doo what you are doing.


NO I don't think you know your arse from your elbow, you rude pr**k

Just because I got a terminology or two wrong doesn't mean the underlying transaction attempt was not as I described. I don't think a discussion at the brokerage took place whereby they said "oh, this woman has used the word margin instead of ..or she has bought 1 x something but didn't call it a CFD so we won't honour the trade.

Are you that much of a jerk that you believe someone should be refused service just because the seller decides they don't want to sell for no good reason, after specifically having a conversation with that same person to say they could buy that asset.

Are you going to the supermarket tomorrow and will ask the shop assistant. Can you sell me a bag of Kettle crisps. They say 'no we call them chips not crisps, so no we won't serve them to you?

The whole line of argument you are taking is ridiculous, patronising and shows what a totally misinformed jerk you are.

No, I haven't been trading long. I also profusely apologise to you personally if I have offended you by using a few terminologies inappropriately. It seems that is a terrible thing to happen. I hope you get over it and it hasn't caused you any lasting harm.

Frankly, you haven't a scooby doo idea of how to treat people. You obviously think kicking people whilst they are down is fun. Well, rock on mate. I hope you experience the same treatment when you go on a forum expecting some help and all you get is abuse.





First up, Mark is one of very few people I've seen who actually spread bets successfully, and does understand the game.

To use your own analogy, what you've really done is walk into your supermarket, and rather than buying one bag of crisps, you've given them one bag's worth of money and they've lent you the other 49 bags and will expect you to pay for them next week. So now it's up to you to make a profit, and have the ability to clear your debt, which is your margin. If you can't do this, you still owe the whole debt for said crisps, and you'll get "a margin call". They want their pound of flesh, and you agreed to pay it!

But the margin is the leverage, not the initial stake. Until this becomes clear, you're playing a serious mug's game, and no amount of getting angry on the internet will help.


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3 users thanked mdss68 for this post.
SimonHughes on 25/08/2020(UTC), Guest on 25/08/2020(UTC), Nigel Harris on 25/08/2020(UTC)
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