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Wave and tide technology
Easyrider
Posted: 13 August 2022 12:56:25(UTC)
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I have always thought, mistakenly perhaps, that the UK had vast reserves of potential power in the form of harnessing wave and tide forces around our shores.
It seems that we have one of the largest "heights" between low and high tides in the world.
It was only a matter of harnessing this obvious, continuous source of energy,which could be safely left to our engineering boffins, in order to generate all the electricity we need in all weather conditions.
You only have to swim a few yards from a beach and be hit by a wave to experience the huge amount of force which sends you tumbling underwater.
Apparently, the tides flow up the North Sea and the Irish sea every day and then out again.
But it hasn't happened.
Why?
There's been talk of barriages such as the Severn barrage for years but it hasn't progressed possibly because of the impact on migrating fish and bird life.
There are some small schemes in Scotland and underwater turbines at Strangford Lough in Northern Ireland, but these seem to be reseach-orientated rather than significant producers of energy.
Are there fundamental technical issues or is the concept flawed?
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Tim D on 13/08/2022(UTC), Martina on 13/08/2022(UTC), Phil 2 on 31/01/2024(UTC)
ANDREW FOSTER
Posted: 13 August 2022 13:12:24(UTC)
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There are environmental and technical issues.

Apparently the biggie for the Severn Barrage (side from the cost) is the fact that sand and silt would build up behind it and render it useless within 30-50 years.

Also the loss of habitat for wading birds etc. is deemed an unacceptable price.

We have a lot of on-shore hydro potential that isn't used, again fish are the "problem".



I'm a big fan of micro generation, solar, wind and water. Perhaps the high energy prices will finally make this more viable for individuals/farms/offices etc.


What we really need is are systems that can literally be plugged into 13 amp sockets and are connected via 4G to to your billing system. I'd invest in any company that was doing that....





4 users thanked ANDREW FOSTER for this post.
Easyrider on 13/08/2022(UTC), Martina on 13/08/2022(UTC), Tim D on 13/08/2022(UTC), Captain Slugwash on 13/08/2022(UTC)
DIY Investing
Posted: 13 August 2022 13:19:06(UTC)
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Siemens gave up on it and sold it’s tidal power unit. That suggests it’s about as viable as most green tech.
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Easyrider on 13/08/2022(UTC), Jawell Nofine on 07/04/2024(UTC)
Tug Boat
Posted: 13 August 2022 14:33:10(UTC)
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I know a little bit about this. It’s viable in the southwest. Tides elsewhere aren’t big enough. It long term payback, so that negates most investment.

It’s like the old tidal mills from 500 years ago.

There’s nothing stopping it other than the upfront cost and long payback time.

It would have to be government sponsored, and all governments are a bag of crap cos they don’t employ engineers.
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Tim D on 13/08/2022(UTC), ANDREW FOSTER on 13/08/2022(UTC), Jimmy Page on 13/08/2022(UTC), Easyrider on 13/08/2022(UTC)
Tim D
Posted: 13 August 2022 14:33:12(UTC)
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The tech seems to be considered "still in the development phase".

Interestingly 3 tidal stream projects did just win the government's "CfD" auction, the first time tidal tech has.
https://www.scottishrene...ontracts-for-first-time

But as the prices there show (onshore wind and solar ~£45/MWh, offshore wind £37/MWh, tidal... £179/MWh!!!), at this point it's basically throwing money at a charity case in the hope of it getting cheaper and future "diversity of supply" benefits.
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Jimmy Page on 13/08/2022(UTC), Easyrider on 13/08/2022(UTC)
Tug Boat
Posted: 13 August 2022 14:49:52(UTC)
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The big plus is you can’t turn off a tide without nicking the moon, which is beyond everyone but the North Korean tech superpower.
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Easyrider on 13/08/2022(UTC)
Joe Soap
Posted: 13 August 2022 14:59:47(UTC)
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Tim D;234515 wrote:
The tech seems to be considered "still in the development phase".

Interestingly 3 tidal stream projects did just win the government's "CfD" auction, the first time tidal tech has.
https://www.scottishrene...ontracts-for-first-time

But as the prices there show (onshore wind and solar ~£45/MWh, offshore wind £37/MWh, tidal... £179/MWh!!!), at this point it's basically throwing money at a charity case in the hope of it getting cheaper and future "diversity of supply" benefits.

Thanks I didn't know that tidal generation had won a contract. The price is pretty irrelevant I think in the overall energy market place. We had exactly the same thing during the period where wind and solar power first became active on the grid. It's a very welcome development I think.
3 users thanked Joe Soap for this post.
Tim D on 13/08/2022(UTC), Easyrider on 13/08/2022(UTC), lenahan on 23/02/2023(UTC)
Rob B
Posted: 13 August 2022 15:58:13(UTC)
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Remember the Swansea Bay project? Good info on the link. I remember a stat saying harnessing energy from wave power was something like 8% efficient.

That was some time ago; I doff my hat to others more knowledgable but I do recall ROI was a challenge...
Tim D
Posted: 13 August 2022 19:20:15(UTC)
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Tug Boat;234518 wrote:
The big plus is you can’t turn off a tide without nicking the moon, which is beyond everyone but the North Korean tech superpower.


The vulnerable bit of offshore power generation is the HVDC cables connecting them to the shore. Don't know about the Norks but Russia is thought to have been developing specialist subsea-cable cutting submarines and submersibles. Most of the reporting on them focuses on the threat to the global data cable network - perhaps because journos are horrified by the thought of life without Twitter - but if I was Russia I think subsea power cables might be similarly attractive targets, both the "interconnect" ones connecting the UK and Ireland to continental Europe and the ones bringing power from large offshore wind farms ashore.
SF100
Posted: 13 August 2022 19:59:15(UTC)
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Worth having a scout around this Orbital website, not least to understand the scale of these things
The 'projects' page shows 3 locations, I believe Orkney is at least installed several months ago, not sure if operating

https://orbitalmarine.com/about/

and possibly it's predecessor, also located near Orkney

https://www.emec.org.uk/...nts/pelamis-wave-power/

I imagine the maintenance of these things must be pretty high
3 users thanked SF100 for this post.
Tim D on 13/08/2022(UTC), Easyrider on 13/08/2022(UTC), lenahan on 23/02/2023(UTC)
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