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Climate Change - The Agenda
Jimmy Page
Posted: 17 July 2023 17:49:31(UTC)

Joined: 11/11/2017(UTC)
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Well, the industry is really ramping up the rhetoric, using the el nino and la nina perturbations (so called apparently by Peruvian fisherman in the 1600's) before the current el nino works through. Which it will, of course.

""Extreme weather is already leading to "crop losses, high food prices and loss of life", a senior climate scientist has said.
Prof John Marsham, from the School of Earth and Environment at the University of Leeds, said that unless we switch from fossil fuels to renewables and clean power the situation would "continue to get worse".
It will "wipe out entire ecosystems", he said."
No vested interest with Prof Marsham and the team.

"Parts of southern Europe are likely to get very close to the record temperature for the region, a senior scientist has told Sky News.
Carlo Buontempo, director of the Copernicus Climate Change Service at the European Centre for Medium Range Weather Forecasts, said several countries could match the previous maximum or set a new one."
No vested interest with M. Buontempo and the team.

""Earth will become an "inferno" if the heatwaves don't spur on governments to tackle global warming, a climate scientist has warned.
Humanity should expect "more frequent and intense" extreme weather events if global temperatures continue to rise at their current rate, said Dr Akshay Deoras, from the University of Reading's meteorology department."
No vested interest with Dr Deoras and the team.

Anticyclones now have names.

'Heat storms' are now a thing.

Weather maps hurt the eyes.

It's extraordinary to watch the industry in action. Then there's the politicians - need an excuse for not having fixed the drains/ kept forest firebreaks clear/ managed mountain deforestation to control monsoon runoff, maybe? The industry is here to help.

Have 24 hours of rolling news to fill and a new 'climate catastrophe' department built around an ambitious young 'climate crisis correspondent' to justify? The industry is here to help.
Today, there's a thunderstorm in Canada, some flooding somewhere...more than enough content for everyone.
Quick, employ more 'climate crisis communicators'!
5 users thanked Jimmy Page for this post.
ANDREW FOSTER on 17/07/2023(UTC), Tyrion Lannister on 17/07/2023(UTC), Guest on 18/07/2023(UTC), Dexi on 18/07/2023(UTC), stephen_s on 18/07/2023(UTC)
Zach F
Posted: 17 July 2023 19:04:02(UTC)

Joined: 28/12/2020(UTC)
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Steve U;273457 wrote:
Zach F;273371 wrote:
Steve U;273366 wrote:
Rather than the BBC, I prefer to listen to people like this about climate change


Quote:
as soon as someone tells you the planet's warming, the reply you give is "since when"


https://twitter.com/mark...678818973830246409?s=20


full speech here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txQcX0fm5bs


Quote:
Professor Ian Plimer is Australia’s best-known geologist. He is Emeritus Professor of Earth Sciences at the University of Melbourne, where he was Professor and Head of Earth Sciences (1991-2005) after serving at the University of Newcastle (1985-1991) as Professor and Head of Geology.


no doubt you won't be able to listen to him for much longer though


Personally I prefer to listen to someone who don’t have a vested interest in the matter; pilmers links to the mining industry make me think he may well just be a little unbiased…. But I guess what ever reinforces your own world view is the order of the day.


So who is that Zach ?


NASA? The Royal Society? Or take your pick of any leading university? Google’s a really handy tool to inform yourself and debunk the bullshit, Plimers been called out plenty of times and his arguements don’t hold up very well under scrutiny.

But let’s be frank, replying to this thread with my point of view is a complete waste of time; you’ve got a bloke in his 70/80s using buzz words like a teenager; a seasoned forum troll on his 5th?(?) account, and a chap who is apparently a investing guru who can time the market but somehow has a pot of 500ish k without having kids and living through the greatest bull run in history????! to think any of these chumps are able to offer anything than vitriol is the height of naïveté so I’m not going to bother. PS Steve none of this paragraph is aimed at you.
1 user thanked Zach F for this post.
chazza on 18/07/2023(UTC)
Steve U
Posted: 17 July 2023 21:54:48(UTC)

Joined: 30/08/2017(UTC)
Posts: 336

Zach F;273537 wrote:
Steve U;273457 wrote:
Zach F;273371 wrote:
Steve U;273366 wrote:
Rather than the BBC, I prefer to listen to people like this about climate change


Quote:
as soon as someone tells you the planet's warming, the reply you give is "since when"


https://twitter.com/mark...678818973830246409?s=20


full speech here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txQcX0fm5bs


Quote:
Professor Ian Plimer is Australia’s best-known geologist. He is Emeritus Professor of Earth Sciences at the University of Melbourne, where he was Professor and Head of Earth Sciences (1991-2005) after serving at the University of Newcastle (1985-1991) as Professor and Head of Geology.


no doubt you won't be able to listen to him for much longer though


Personally I prefer to listen to someone who don’t have a vested interest in the matter; pilmers links to the mining industry make me think he may well just be a little unbiased…. But I guess what ever reinforces your own world view is the order of the day.


So who is that Zach ?


NASA? The Royal Society? Or take your pick of any leading university? Google’s a really handy tool to inform yourself and debunk the bullshit, Plimers been called out plenty of times and his arguements don’t hold up very well under scrutiny.

But let’s be frank, replying to this thread with my point of view is a complete waste of time; you’ve got a bloke in his 70/80s using buzz words like a teenager; a seasoned forum troll on his 5th?(?) account, and a chap who is apparently a investing guru who can time the market but somehow has a pot of 500ish k without having kids and living through the greatest bull run in history????! to think any of these chumps are able to offer anything than vitriol is the height of naïveté so I’m not going to bother. PS Steve none of this paragraph is aimed at you.


ok thanks Zach - I'm not sure who you're slagging off but thanks for saying it's not me - Nasa, The Royal Society - anyone not financed by the US Government or big tech/pharma ?
Jimmy Page
Posted: 17 July 2023 22:37:19(UTC)

Joined: 11/11/2017(UTC)
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The Acropolis was closed to tourists yesterday. Closed! Climate catastrophe!
The temperature hit 40 deg. C.! What a story!

The BBC are on the case, reporting from the heart of the inferno -
"Rome resident Elena, 62 told the BBC that she has noticed a "marked change" in summer temperatures since around 2003, and that they have been growing exponentially since."
Exponentially! Since 2003!

(Ahem. On July 10, 1977, Athens hit 48°C, with higher temps elsewhere in the Mediterranean. One tourist died on Crete. Others treated for heatstroke etc. Acropolis did not close, of course.)

(And for the science followers - Since 1977, industrial era atmospheric CO2 has increased by 170%.)

Edit. The 'Southern Europe on fire' story has been enriched with footage of wildfires and fleeing tourists around.... La Palma, the Canary Islands.
The temperature there had not reached 25 deg. C.
5 users thanked Jimmy Page for this post.
Tyrion Lannister on 17/07/2023(UTC), Guest on 18/07/2023(UTC), Steve U on 18/07/2023(UTC), Dexi on 18/07/2023(UTC), stephen_s on 18/07/2023(UTC)
Tyrion Lannister
Posted: 17 July 2023 23:18:21(UTC)

Joined: 03/03/2017(UTC)
Posts: 2,029

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Let’s just say that the “climate disaster” is what the eco disciples and media say it is.

I fail to understand why anything the UK does will make the slightest difference. Wrt traffic, anyone who’s travelled in Asia and Africa will know what a joke it is pretending that taxing fuel in the UK will make the slightest difference to anything.

Same with industrial emissions, China, India, Russia etc. will do what they want and revel in the West making themselves uncompetitive by trying to “save the planet.” 🙄
5 users thanked Tyrion Lannister for this post.
Jimmy Page on 17/07/2023(UTC), Guest on 18/07/2023(UTC), Jonathan Friend on 18/07/2023(UTC), Dexi on 18/07/2023(UTC), stephen_s on 18/07/2023(UTC)
ANDREW FOSTER
Posted: 18 July 2023 04:57:52(UTC)

Joined: 23/07/2019(UTC)
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Zach wrote:


NASA? The Royal Society? Or take your pick of any leading university? Google’s a really handy tool to inform yourself and debunk the bullshit, Plimers been called out plenty of times and his arguements don’t hold up very well under scrutiny.

But let’s be frank, replying to this thread with my point of view is a complete waste of time; you’ve got a bloke in his 70/80s using buzz words like a teenager; a seasoned forum troll on his 5th?(?) account, and a chap who is apparently a investing guru who can time the market but somehow has a pot of 500ish k without having kids and living through the greatest bull run in history????! to think any of these chumps are able to offer anything than vitriol is the height of naïveté so I’m not going to bother. PS Steve none of this paragraph is aimed at you.


You OK, hon?



I guess ad hominems are easier than addressing the points being presented 🤗 Your Participation Certificate is in the post...
2 users thanked ANDREW FOSTER for this post.
Guest on 18/07/2023(UTC), Jimmy Page on 23/07/2023(UTC)
Zach F
Posted: 18 July 2023 06:24:55(UTC)

Joined: 28/12/2020(UTC)
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Steve U;273543 wrote:


ok thanks Zach - I'm not sure who you're slagging off but thanks for saying it's not me - Nasa, The Royal Society - anyone not financed by the US Government or big tech/pharma ?


The Royal Society is a charity and has multiple funding sources, same with universities. I get the point you’re making, but don’t understand why you wouldn’t apply that line of thinking to someone like Plimer?

40 odd years ago you certainly didn’t have the US government funding climate science, it’s something that’s grown from a hippy conspiracy to what it is now, widely accepted because of scientific consensus.

1 user thanked Zach F for this post.
chazza on 18/07/2023(UTC)
Jonathan Friend
Posted: 18 July 2023 08:24:45(UTC)

Joined: 19/09/2022(UTC)
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Zach F;273555 wrote:
Steve U;273543 wrote:


ok thanks Zach - I'm not sure who you're slagging off but thanks for saying it's not me - Nasa, The Royal Society - anyone not financed by the US Government or big tech/pharma ?


The Royal Society is a charity and has multiple funding sources, same with universities. I get the point you’re making, but don’t understand why you wouldn’t apply that line of thinking to someone like Plimer?

40 odd years ago you certainly didn’t have the US government funding climate science, it’s something that’s grown from a hippy conspiracy to what it is now, widely accepted because of scientific consensus.



"Widely accepted"... "scientific consensus"... so Isaac Newton must have been wrong then.

Google is a search engine, and a biased one. I just did a search on global warming consensus and The Guardian appeared three times on the top page of results. The Guardian...

The 97% consensus idea is based on a research paper (Cook et al, 2013), which counted amongst its survey large numbers of papers that were incidental to the question, i.e. where the authors were not directly discussing the impact of humans on climate change, and made sweeping assumptions about what researchers believe based on what they did not say rather than what they did say. You can read it for yourself. It is cod science in its own right.

Global warming went from being a niche hypothesis, and an unpopular one versus global freezing in the 1970s, when the Thatcher government latched on to it as a way to promote nuclear power and hit the strike prone coal industry. Sweden did the exact same thing with the acid rain narrative when governments there were trying to persuade the public to accept nuclear. It has largely been driven by politics, not science.

You haven't named any physicists or other actual scientists who agree with whatever your view is. Just referred to vague groupings like "universities". So basically, you know better than Professor William Happer, an expert in atomic physics and climate spectroscopy, because you went on Google... That's what you'd say to him if you were face to face having a conversation?
5 users thanked Jonathan Friend for this post.
NoMoreKickingCans on 18/07/2023(UTC), Jimmy Page on 18/07/2023(UTC), Dexi on 18/07/2023(UTC), Guest on 18/07/2023(UTC), stephen_s on 18/07/2023(UTC)
ANDREW FOSTER
Posted: 18 July 2023 08:38:04(UTC)

Joined: 23/07/2019(UTC)
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The entire global warming science is predicated on just one thing.

That one thing is that the CO2 in the atmosphere rising from 0.03% to 0.04% spells catastrophe for the planet.

That's it. Everything stems from that.


"Does that sound likely?" is my starting point.

At present, I do not believe that such a trivial change can change the planets' temperature by 2 degrees.
6 users thanked ANDREW FOSTER for this post.
NoMoreKickingCans on 18/07/2023(UTC), Jimmy Page on 18/07/2023(UTC), Jonathan Friend on 18/07/2023(UTC), Guest on 18/07/2023(UTC), stephen_s on 18/07/2023(UTC), Tyrion Lannister on 18/07/2023(UTC)
NoMoreKickingCans
Posted: 18 July 2023 09:40:29(UTC)

Joined: 26/02/2012(UTC)
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Yes, you can’t help but think where is that CO2 coming from - fossil fuels. And where do fossil fuels come from - plant life. So in that sense when we burn fossil fuels we are returning to the atmosphere the CO2 that past plant life itself sequestered from the atmosphere. If past plant life has been sequestering CO2 into the ground then presumably the atmospheric CO2 levels have been reduced from what they would otherwise be by that happening and before mankind made any difference. So could we argue we are returning the atmosphere back towards where it was in the long distant past ?

Perhaps this is a good thing, rather than a bad thing ? Who knows ?

There are many sources of climate/temperature variation, and competing theories. Few if any experiments actually get done, just observations (which are then often adjusted using questionable criteria) and then people saying - it must be X. Sunspots, solar radiation, cloud cover, behaviour of the seas as a giant heat mass, volcanic activity, convection changes in the earth’s mantle, known long cycle variations associated with the precession of the magnetic poles/earth’s orbit, reflective snow cover. I can’t really see much ‘’settled science’’ here.
4 users thanked NoMoreKickingCans for this post.
Jonathan Friend on 18/07/2023(UTC), Jimmy Page on 18/07/2023(UTC), Guest on 18/07/2023(UTC), stephen_s on 18/07/2023(UTC)
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