Funds Insider - Opening the door to funds

Welcome to the Citywire Funds Insider Forums, where members share investment ideas and discuss everything to do with their money.

You'll need to log in or set up an account to start new discussions or reply to existing ones. See you inside!

Notification

Icon
Error
Pershing Square Holdings (PSH)
+ Reply to discussion
Options
Mr GL
Posted: 16 January 2025 07:51:26(UTC)
#605

Joined: 18/10/2020(UTC)
Posts: 5,125

Thanks: 6758 times
Was thanked: 17954 time(s) in 4234 post(s)
PSH NAV per share as of close of business on 14 January 2025 was 72.08 USD / 59.06 GBP and year-to-date performance was 1.4%.

SP at close 4256p (+9.4% YTD)

Discount 28%

I foolishly sold all of my holding towards end of last year.... booo hoo....
Back to top Quote
5 users thanked Mr GL for this post.
Helen L on 16/01/2025(UTC), Raj K on 16/01/2025(UTC), Big boy on 16/01/2025(UTC), Johan De Silva on 16/01/2025(UTC), Auric on 18/01/2025(UTC)
Raj K
Posted: 16 January 2025 08:31:57(UTC)
#600

Joined: 22/04/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,819

Thanks: 6461 times
Was thanked: 6652 time(s) in 2091 post(s)
Newbie;331059 wrote:
Johan De Silva;330995 wrote:
Raj K;330991 wrote:
https://assets.pershingsquareholdings.com/2025/01/13060332/HHH-Proposal-Letter.pdf

if anyone can understand what benefit this has to PSH holders, it would be good to know. Made my way through it but as with lots of Ackman seems very complicated. Taking the obivous away they want to recognise the true value of HHH does this mean that PSH itself will be able to list in the US? Maybe not given what reported bleow, it will be a seperate holding company? I suppose PSH shares will roll over into the new entity.

Note from a press release: Ackman wants to transform Howard Hughes into a “modern-day Berkshire Hathaway that would acquire controlling interests in operating companies,” he said, using existing cash and cash from the transaction for the new investments.


Explained well here: https://www.ft.com/conte...-4c98-a8a7-9a7fe253023d

I would presume merger would mean HHH and PSH will eventually be the same company or at least share some of the same assets?

The idea is that PSH sits at the top and HHH below, and wholly owned by PSH (unless other companies also want to take part). Then with time PSH would buy other companies some which are wholly owned, others partly and others in JV measure. The old BH.

Two major benefits are that a) PSH has a trading company making it easier to list and b) a constant revenue stream which can be fed up to the holding company (and down from it) in a tax efficient manner.

That is my understanding.


I have asked PSH IR to explain this transaction in simple terms and what it means for PSH shareholders..
Back to top Quote
3 users thanked Raj K for this post.
Pre Ka on 16/01/2025(UTC), Newbie on 16/01/2025(UTC), Auric on 18/01/2025(UTC)
Big boy
Posted: 16 January 2025 09:05:58(UTC)
#610

Joined: 20/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 6,678

Thanks: 5662 times
Was thanked: 11110 time(s) in 4250 post(s)
Mr GL;331212 wrote:
PSH NAV per share as of close of business on 14 January 2025 was 72.08 USD / 59.06 GBP and year-to-date performance was 1.4%.

SP at close 4256p (+9.4% YTD)

Discount 28%

I foolishly sold all of my holding towards end of last year.... booo hoo....


I have found they tend to trade between 25% and 35% discount so move from overweight to underweight when appropriate.

If they can resolve some of the issues that preclude Investors buying we might see the discount narrow.
Back to top Quote
1 user thanked Big boy for this post.
Johan De Silva on 16/01/2025(UTC)
Raj K
Posted: 16 January 2025 09:17:29(UTC)
#606

Joined: 22/04/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,819

Thanks: 6461 times
Was thanked: 6652 time(s) in 2091 post(s)
Mr GL;331212 wrote:
PSH NAV per share as of close of business on 14 January 2025 was 72.08 USD / 59.06 GBP and year-to-date performance was 1.4%.

SP at close 4256p (+9.4% YTD)

Discount 28%

I foolishly sold all of my holding towards end of last year.... booo hoo....


I know you have a distinct strategy but some holdings such as PSH and Brookfield (if I recall correctly you bought and sold) might deserve a place in the buy and hold bucket? The underlying ethos of the people that run these is to compound value over a long time.
Back to top Quote
3 users thanked Raj K for this post.
Johan De Silva on 16/01/2025(UTC), Mr GL on 16/01/2025(UTC), Auric on 18/01/2025(UTC)
Big boy
Posted: 16 January 2025 09:42:10(UTC)
#607

Joined: 20/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 6,678

Thanks: 5662 times
Was thanked: 11110 time(s) in 4250 post(s)
Raj K;331228 wrote:
Mr GL;331212 wrote:
PSH NAV per share as of close of business on 14 January 2025 was 72.08 USD / 59.06 GBP and year-to-date performance was 1.4%.

SP at close 4256p (+9.4% YTD)

Discount 28%

I foolishly sold all of my holding towards end of last year.... booo hoo....


I know you have a distinct strategy but some holdings such as PSH and Brookfield (if I recall correctly you bought and sold) might deserve a place in the buy and hold bucket? The underlying ethos of the people that run these is to compound value over a long time.


So you would even hold when they went to a premium.....surly a stock must be relatively over or undervalued as the personnel and other issues change... You are closely looking at what the Company is doing but you are sill happy to be long term without fully understanding some of the short term issues.

We have seen many times investors trusting the past well into the future and so often the circumstances change.

I am pleased to see you are trending to-wards undervalued Trusts/Assets (good discounts on underlying Investments)
Back to top Quote
1 user thanked Big boy for this post.
Raj K on 16/01/2025(UTC)
Raj K
Posted: 16 January 2025 10:06:21(UTC)
#608

Joined: 22/04/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,819

Thanks: 6461 times
Was thanked: 6652 time(s) in 2091 post(s)
Big boy;331233 wrote:
Raj K;331228 wrote:
Mr GL;331212 wrote:
PSH NAV per share as of close of business on 14 January 2025 was 72.08 USD / 59.06 GBP and year-to-date performance was 1.4%.

SP at close 4256p (+9.4% YTD)

Discount 28%

I foolishly sold all of my holding towards end of last year.... booo hoo....


I know you have a distinct strategy but some holdings such as PSH and Brookfield (if I recall correctly you bought and sold) might deserve a place in the buy and hold bucket? The underlying ethos of the people that run these is to compound value over a long time.


So you would even hold when they went to a premium.....surly a stock must be relatively over or undervalued as the personnel and other issues change... You are closely looking at what the Company is doing but you are sill happy to be long term without fully understanding some of the short term issues.

We have seen many times investors trusting the past well into the future and so often the circumstances change.

I am pleased to see you are trending to-wards undervalued Trusts/Assets (good discounts on underlying Investments)


For Brookfield I would look at the underlying earnings of the company . They use a metric called distributable earnings which I think is similar to free cash flow…and projected growth in those earnings to determine if it was under or over valued. If PSH went to a premium and was still only holding other listed companies then I might sell but remember they do other macro bets too so it’s not an easy decision.

I’ve always been buying trusts or companies on a discount ( minus a few exceptions)The only difference is I am selective in which I buy and my intention a the outset is that I’m buying a trust/ company I’d like to hold for a long time so as long as nothing radically changes with the manager or strategy etc or in the case of an indvdual company its fundamentals.
Back to top Quote
 |  Edit by user
4 users thanked Raj K for this post.
Rookie Investor on 16/01/2025(UTC), Big boy on 16/01/2025(UTC), Helen L on 16/01/2025(UTC), Auric on 18/01/2025(UTC)
Rookie Investor
Posted: 16 January 2025 10:46:07(UTC)
#609

Joined: 09/12/2020(UTC)
Posts: 2,081

Thanks: 1341 times
Was thanked: 3627 time(s) in 1413 post(s)
Raj K;331236 wrote:
Big boy;331233 wrote:
Raj K;331228 wrote:
Mr GL;331212 wrote:
PSH NAV per share as of close of business on 14 January 2025 was 72.08 USD / 59.06 GBP and year-to-date performance was 1.4%.

SP at close 4256p (+9.4% YTD)

Discount 28%

I foolishly sold all of my holding towards end of last year.... booo hoo....


I know you have a distinct strategy but some holdings such as PSH and Brookfield (if I recall correctly you bought and sold) might deserve a place in the buy and hold bucket? The underlying ethos of the people that run these is to compound value over a long time.


So you would even hold when they went to a premium.....surly a stock must be relatively over or undervalued as the personnel and other issues change... You are closely looking at what the Company is doing but you are sill happy to be long term without fully understanding some of the short term issues.

We have seen many times investors trusting the past well into the future and so often the circumstances change.

I am pleased to see you are trending to-wards undervalued Trusts/Assets (good discounts on underlying Investments)


For Brookfield I would look at the underlying earnings of the company . They use a metric called distributable earnings which I think is similar to free cash flow…and projected growth in those earnings to determine if it was under or over valued. If PSH went to a premium and was still only holding other listed companies then I might sell but remember they do other macro bets too so it’s not an easy decision.

I’ve always been buying trusts or companies on a discount ( minus a few exceptions)The only difference is I am selective in which I buy and my intention a the outset is that I’m buying a trust/ company I’d like to hold for a long time so as long as nothing radically changes with the manager or strategy etc or in the case of an indvdual company its fundamentals.


Brookfield is one I missed and wish I looked into it last year. Think it is a good long term holding like Brk or PSH but not sure when to buy into it as it is hard to value and complex business. Will wait patiently for a dip knowing that it could rise further.

Fortunately I bought PSH last year on the dip in the summer and has done well recently.
Back to top Quote
2 users thanked Rookie Investor for this post.
Big boy on 16/01/2025(UTC), Raj K on 16/01/2025(UTC)
Sara G
Posted: 16 January 2025 10:56:07(UTC)
#611

Joined: 07/05/2015(UTC)
Posts: 4,038

Thanks: 13065 times
Was thanked: 16835 time(s) in 3507 post(s)
Just to note that PSH is no longer available to buy on HL.
Back to top Quote
2 users thanked Sara G for this post.
Raj K on 16/01/2025(UTC), Rookie Investor on 16/01/2025(UTC)
Raj K
Posted: 16 January 2025 10:58:54(UTC)
#613

Joined: 22/04/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,819

Thanks: 6461 times
Was thanked: 6652 time(s) in 2091 post(s)
@ Rookie watch their last 2024 Investor day presentation on their website and there was also a good general interview with Brookefiled CEO Bruce Flatt and the Norges Investment Bank.

https://www.youtube.com/...v=vTd02-0BiOM&t=26s

I'm still trying to understand Brookfield and probably never will in the detail like other single companies. So many diverse earning streams. . Bruce Flatt seems well regarded CEO and by the numbers they provide are still undervalued... and with their view 20% growth p.a in earnings over the next five years.
Back to top Quote
 |  Edit by user
1 user thanked Raj K for this post.
Rookie Investor on 16/01/2025(UTC)
Big boy
Posted: 16 January 2025 11:09:31(UTC)
#612

Joined: 20/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 6,678

Thanks: 5662 times
Was thanked: 11110 time(s) in 4250 post(s)
Sara G;331241 wrote:
Just to note that PSH is no longer available to buy on HL.


They don’t know the “cost and charges” so they are creating a false market as many investors are precluded from Investment and become suspicious of the Company and the way it’s run . Surely we should be protected from selling as well as clearly HL are putting up warning signs.

Clearly not a level playing field as we don’t have the same information from AjB or HL so should they be referred to the Authorities.

Can anyone prove that higher costs/charges have an adverse effect on performance.
Back to top Quote
 |  Edit by user
1 user thanked Big boy for this post.
Guest on 16/01/2025(UTC)
68 Pages«Previous page5960616263Next page»
+ Reply to discussion

Markets

Other markets