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Premium Bonds
Stephen B.
Posted: 05 December 2024 13:37:58(UTC)
#42

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Sara G;327766 wrote:
Recently Redundant and Retired;327746 wrote:
I noticed on the NS&I website that lists the Premium Bond prizes, there didn't seem to be a single prize on a bond bought prior to the year 2000, is there a reason for this ?


Well, they claim that every bond has a separate and equal chance of winning and I see no reason to disbelieve this. My guess is that the majority of bonds will have been bought in more recent times, and most older bonds would have been cashed in as their owners have passed on, as they can't be inherited.


I had some bonds bought by my parents as a child and I've never sold out. However I have made partial sales over the years, e.g. I used them as a temporary store for a house deposit, and looking at recent records it looks like they must sell the oldest bonds first because the oldest ones I have now are blocks in the thousands. Once upon a time you had physical certificates so you could choose what to sell but they were dematerialised a few decades back - unlike share certificates where we're still waiting! Wearing a programmer's hat it would be a pain to have to deal with a very sparse set of old bonds with numbers in different formats so I can imagine it being a policy to try to reduce them.
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Sara G on 05/12/2024(UTC)
Sara G
Posted: 05 December 2024 14:07:41(UTC)
#43

Joined: 07/05/2015(UTC)
Posts: 4,042

Stephen B.;327820 wrote:
Sara G;327766 wrote:
Recently Redundant and Retired;327746 wrote:
I noticed on the NS&I website that lists the Premium Bond prizes, there didn't seem to be a single prize on a bond bought prior to the year 2000, is there a reason for this ?


Well, they claim that every bond has a separate and equal chance of winning and I see no reason to disbelieve this. My guess is that the majority of bonds will have been bought in more recent times, and most older bonds would have been cashed in as their owners have passed on, as they can't be inherited.


I had some bonds bought by my parents as a child and I've never sold out. However I have made partial sales over the years, e.g. I used them as a temporary store for a house deposit, and looking at recent records it looks like they must sell the oldest bonds first because the oldest ones I have now are blocks in the thousands. Once upon a time you had physical certificates so you could choose what to sell but they were dematerialised a few decades back - unlike share certificates where we're still waiting! Wearing a programmer's hat it would be a pain to have to deal with a very sparse set of old bonds with numbers in different formats so I can imagine it being a policy to try to reduce them.


That would have been my assumption, but recently they wrote to me to let me know that I had £15 worth under a different holder's number - presumably bought for me when I was born or thereabouts - and they cancelled the newest bonds, not the oldest to bring my total balance back to £50K.
Stephen B.
Posted: 05 December 2024 14:19:26(UTC)
#44

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Sara G;327824 wrote:
That would have been my assumption, but recently they wrote to me to let me know that I had £15 worth under a different holder's number - presumably bought for me when I was born or thereabouts - and they cancelled the newest bonds, not the oldest to bring my total balance back to £50K.


I hope they refunded you and didn't just cancel them. That's a somewhat different situation because it was the last purchase that was invalid. Presumably if one of them had won a prize they would have asked for it back! You didn't have any outstanding prizes on the £15? I make that about a prize per 120 years at current odds ...
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Sara G on 05/12/2024(UTC)
Jane Daisy
Posted: 05 December 2024 14:24:42(UTC)
#47

Joined: 10/06/2024(UTC)
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I have just checked my NS&I account and my original £1 bond is still there, purchased in 1958. As to whether it has ever won a brass farthing I don't know.
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Jay P on 05/12/2024(UTC), Sara G on 05/12/2024(UTC)
Sara G
Posted: 05 December 2024 15:03:21(UTC)
#45

Joined: 07/05/2015(UTC)
Posts: 4,042

Stephen B.;327826 wrote:
Sara G;327824 wrote:
That would have been my assumption, but recently they wrote to me to let me know that I had £15 worth under a different holder's number - presumably bought for me when I was born or thereabouts - and they cancelled the newest bonds, not the oldest to bring my total balance back to £50K.


I hope they refunded you and didn't just cancel them. That's a somewhat different situation because it was the last purchase that was invalid. Presumably if one of them had won a prize they would have asked for it back! You didn't have any outstanding prizes on the £15? I make that about a prize per 120 years at current odds ...


Yes, the £15 was refunded. I think it must happen a lot, as the letter was not at all accusatory in nature, as might have been the case if they took the view that I was trying to cheat the system! The cancelled bonds hadn't won any prizes, fortunately. I assume that the old ones haven't either, as they reallocated them to my current holder's number, so I would expect the prize checker to have flagged up any prizes for them.
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Stephen B. on 05/12/2024(UTC)
RT7
Posted: 05 December 2024 15:13:09(UTC)
#48

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A friend of mine held £50k in Prem Bonds, he bought in stages over last 20/30 years or so. He was winning usual sort of thing a few £25 wins each month. He then sold the lot, started buying back in chunks of £5k over a period of time, and his win rate started to improve. He is convinced that more recently purchased bonds have a higher win rate. I may try this "recycling" as an experiment from Jan 2025.
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Sara G on 05/12/2024(UTC)
Stephen B.
Posted: 05 December 2024 15:23:28(UTC)
#49

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RT7;327836 wrote:
A friend of mine held £50k in Prem Bonds, he bought in stages over last 20/30 years or so. He was winning usual sort of thing a few £25 wins each month. He then sold the lot, started buying back in chunks of £5k over a period of time, and his win rate started to improve. He is convinced that more recently purchased bonds have a higher win rate. I may try this "recycling" as an experiment from Jan 2025.


I think that's mainly because the interest rate rose a lot in the last couple of years so everyone has had a lot more prizes. Also as I said earlier the fluctuations month to month are very large so it's easy to feel that things are unusually good or bad when it's just random - something very familiar in the stockmarket of course. In a way premium bonds are a good test of psychology as to how inclined you are to see patterns in random events.
5 users thanked Stephen B. for this post.
Jay P on 05/12/2024(UTC), Sara G on 05/12/2024(UTC), Guest on 05/12/2024(UTC), SSJ on 05/12/2024(UTC), KMH on 05/12/2024(UTC)
OmegaMale
Posted: 05 December 2024 16:17:41(UTC)
#46

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Recently Redundant and Retired;327746 wrote:
I noticed on the NS&I website that lists the Premium Bond prizes, there didn't seem to be a single prize on a bond bought prior to the year 2000, is there a reason for this ?


Absolutely not the case

Using https://www.thisismoney....ds-winning-numbers.html

You can search and sort the winning bonds in many ways, According to those data, the oldest winners of prizes of £5K or higher this month were as follows:

Prize Area Value of bond Winning bond number Total holding Purchase date
£5,000 Kent £5 2EZ318982 £31 Feb-59
£10,000 Cumbria £5 5EW037094 £15 Apr-68
£5,000 Reading £10 8KT801093 £50 Jul-72
£50,000 Barnet £100 16VK075099 £370 May-77
£10,000 West Midlands £10 22KK911476 £30 Oct-87
£5,000 Outer London £1,000 24BP306434 £31,000 Nov-87

(Apologies for the formatting)

OM
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KMH on 05/12/2024(UTC)
Keith Clunk
Posted: 05 December 2024 18:36:06(UTC)
#50

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I only have a few hundred in premium bonds currently from when I opened an online NS&I account several years ago prior to covid. I have owned them in the past and received paper certificates back then but cashed those in when I bought my London house back in 2001 as I needed every penny I could lay my hands on.

Talking of that house; it became a rental property in 2012 (when I retired) and will now be put on the market for sale in the first week of 2025. The tenants received early notice just after the Autumn budget and they have since found an alternative and triggered their termination clause at the end of November, which was fine with me.

From the proceeds I will fill my premium bond allocation to the maximum. Part of that decision is to place some money somewhere while I deploy the remainder in a new GIA, for which I will continue reading our low coupon gilt and GIA tax threads and other GIA investment styles with great interest. I have been taking GIA related notes over this past year. Quite the learning curve.

Just to carry on and finish; the house proceeds will effectively form around 55% of total assets. My SIPP and ISAs (45% between them) are fully invested in equities.

I'm rambling on, as usual, but often specific things mean little in isolation and are better with some context.
3 users thanked Keith Clunk for this post.
Jay P on 05/12/2024(UTC), Sara G on 05/12/2024(UTC), wydffart on 05/12/2024(UTC)
OmegaMale
Posted: 20 February 2025 09:32:29(UTC)
#52

Joined: 02/07/2020(UTC)
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According to https://www.nsandi.com/products/premium-bonds, the prize rate is dropping from 4% to to 3,8% effective from the April draw.

No indication that the odds are changing from 1:22000,

The prize breakdown hasn't been updated yet but it is reasonable to assume that the migration of prize values to the smaller denominations will continue.

OM
2 users thanked OmegaMale for this post.
Guest on 20/02/2025(UTC), Sara G on 20/02/2025(UTC)
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