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Money v Making Stuff-Should Britain bid farewell to the golden egg of banking.
Jeremy Bosk
Posted: 24 July 2011 11:32:14(UTC)

Joined: 09/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 1,316

Interesting article on how boardroom ignorance leads to disaster. Subordinates are motivated to conceal information.

http://business.scotsman...prevents-full.6803104.jp
Anonymous Post
Posted: 25 July 2011 15:06:39(UTC)
Anonymous 2 needed this 'Off the Record'

Bringing to your attention another interesting article relating to manufacturing.
BBC News Business 24/07, - House sales have fallen, so why are prices still so high?
After analysis, Robert Gardner, the chief Economist at Nationwide says the key factor determining the house price trend is the character of the local economy.
"It reflects how much manufacturing you have in the area."
"Those regions with most manufacturing are currently those whose prices are the lowest compared to the peak."
Makes interesting reading.
No wonder the Bombardier protest march in Derby on Saturday was clapped by the people of Derby all the way.

Prof Eman


Chris Clark
Posted: 25 July 2011 19:00:03(UTC)

Joined: 11/11/2009(UTC)
Posts: 30

The Banking Golden Eggs were handsome indeed. But inside they were full of lead.
Anonymous Post
Posted: 27 July 2011 19:54:09(UTC)
Anonymous 2 needed this 'Off the Record'

On the Citywire- We are a safe haven.
For services?
Services output in 1st and 2nd Quarter up 0.5% and 0.9%
Business services and finanace providing the biggest cotribution.
Whom are they servicing? Their own pockets?
BUT Production down 1.4% with manufacturing down 0.3%.
Some rebalancing, wait till there is a pick up and we start sucking in imports.
Some growth 0.07%, (0.5-0.5 +0.2)/3 over the last 3 quarters.
Creating private sector jobs-but where? South of the North South divide, and in services?
No wonder the back seat driver Vince is calling for more "imaginative " Quantitative Easing.However, what is required is more than that- interest rises in the South of the NS divide, at least in the London and SE area, to dampen down local inflationary pressures.
Time to sort the rigged London and SE market?
If not, as engineertony has said it needs a miracle to cure our problems.
What do you think?

Prof Eman
Jeremy Bosk
Posted: 27 July 2011 20:13:05(UTC)

Joined: 09/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 1,316

Prof

There are thriving financial services sectors in Manchester, Leeds, Edinburgh and all sorts of out of the way places. We would be in a worse mess without them.
Anonymous Post
Posted: 27 July 2011 23:25:37(UTC)
Anonymous 2 needed this 'Off the Record'

Jeremy Bosk
I have never suggested that we should get rid of services.
My contention is that we have too much of services, a lot of poor and overpriced services e.g banking, financial, legal, and thirdly that their rate of growth in the current climate is not healthy for the economy.
We are already over reliant on them. The Govt over relies on income from them, and as such is snookered and cannot rebalance the economy towards industry, which is necessary if we are to grow in the longer term without increasing Balance of Payments problems.
As such please note that I have nothing against good services in Manchester, Leeds etc.
The increasingly worsening mess we are in is due to excessive reliance on services of dubious value, which make little contribution to our exports and Balance of Payments problems.
As regards market rigging, this was raised by Ted in his post #82, under our Economics/inflation/UK discussion, which recently developed the legal services issues. Nobody yet has bothered to try and express any support for our solicitors and legal services.

Prof Eman
Jeremy Bosk
Posted: 28 July 2011 00:57:46(UTC)

Joined: 09/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 1,316

Prof

I don't care where the growth arises so long as people have jobs. Not all banking, financial and legal services are poor quality. Some countries have very little but services and seem to do quite well. Services are usually labour intensive whereas manufacturing lends itself to automation. So the days of large factories with tens of thousands of workers are over - unless the workers are robots.

I would like to see British industry growing and thriving in terms of sales, profits and new inventions. I value the intellectual perspective of engineers and scientists. I just do not see it providing the answer to our unemployment problems which are far more about the uneducated.
mo khan
Posted: 28 July 2011 14:39:50(UTC)

Joined: 17/11/2010(UTC)
Posts: 10

So days of large factories with tens of thousands of workers are over. – looking around it seems that large factories are being replaced and substituted by even larger Hospitals with greater numbers of workers, followed by Railway stations and mega Airports? At current population, skills and growth rate levels, have we peeked, are they sustainable or has this always been the case and masked by other requirements?
Jeremy Bosk
Posted: 28 July 2011 15:00:05(UTC)

Joined: 09/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 1,316

mo khan

That is the great unknown. Manufacturing employment will probably continue to decline. Which is not to say manufacturing by robots, directed by engineers and scientists, cannot be profitable. Nor is it to say that new manufacturing businesses cannot establish themselves but again most of the jobs will be for the highly educated.

Export oriented service industries can continue to grow so long as they provides a better service and are not too much more expensive than competitors overseas. Local services are limited by the ability of consumers and businesses to pay. That depends on earnings. So sustainability is questionable. Life for the uneducated will get worse.
Anonymous Post
Posted: 28 July 2011 20:28:39(UTC)
Anonymous 2 needed this 'Off the Record'

Jeremy Bosk
Not quite clear what you are referring to when you say "the uneducated." We have blue collar, skilled, semi-skilled unskilled etc to consider. Please be more precise. Secondly, most contributors to this discussion are not impressed by the educational system, so who is to blame?
To develop my point of view on services, we need to consider rip off Britain mostly based on services-banking, financial services, insurance-Has your renewal crashed through the letter box? discussion, legal, etc.
It should be noted that services income is some-one else's cost, especially so in industry/manufacturing. So rip off Britain only makes us less competitive as UK ltd. Manufacturing and industry are at a cost disadvantage even before they start producing.
Hence the snooker part 2.

Prof Eman
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