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Trudy Scrumptious
Posted: 16 February 2021 19:35:17(UTC)
#125

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Aminatidi;153098 wrote:
Interestingly just checked and Personal Assets is 10% behind Ruffer and Capital Gearing on 5 year returns.

Absolutely fascinating looking at the graph how these three have twisted and turned and suddenly Ruffer has gone from villain to (sort of) hero in the space of a couple of months whilst Personal Assets seems to be just flat.

Short-termism maybe but decisions decisions.



So probably the right time to be topping up Personal Assets, or at least rebalancing.
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5 users thanked Trudy Scrumptious for this post.
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Tim D
Posted: 16 February 2021 19:41:02(UTC)
#124

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Aminatidi;153098 wrote:
Absolutely fascinating looking at the graph how these three have twisted and turned and suddenly Ruffer has gone from villain to (sort of) hero in the space of a couple of months whilst Personal Assets seems to be just flat.


This is why I hold all three and when I do top them up, top them all up to rebalance them to equal. Means I'm putting the most into the (hopefully) best value one and less into whichever has got ahead a bit. Seems to have worked out quite well over the years I've been doing it.
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14 users thanked Tim D for this post.
Dan L on 16/02/2021(UTC), Aminatidi on 16/02/2021(UTC), Trudy Scrumptious on 16/02/2021(UTC), Chris Howland on 16/02/2021(UTC), Robin on 16/02/2021(UTC), bill xxxx on 16/02/2021(UTC), Rob B on 16/02/2021(UTC), Joe Average on 16/02/2021(UTC), Sheerman on 16/02/2021(UTC), J Ross on 16/02/2021(UTC), Guest on 17/02/2021(UTC), Jeff Liddiard on 17/02/2021(UTC), Jesse M on 17/02/2021(UTC), Guchi on 26/02/2022(UTC)
Bulldog Drummond
Posted: 16 February 2021 20:19:12(UTC)
#127

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10 years return in the 50% to 70% return range strikes me as absolutely pathetic and I wouldn't touch any of them. I know that I am in a minority (maybe of 1 here) here but I think that the only people making money out of these are the managers

But whatever makes you comfortable....

No personal criticism of anyone who likes the comfort zone but you could have made that 10 year return in the past few months
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bédé on 17/02/2021(UTC)
MartynC
Posted: 16 February 2021 20:55:41(UTC)
#129

Joined: 02/11/2017(UTC)
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Bulldog Drummond;153107 wrote:
10 years return in the 50% to 70% return range strikes me as absolutely pathetic and I wouldn't touch any of them. I know that I am in a minority (maybe of 1 here) here but I think that the only people making money out of these are the managers

But whatever makes you comfortable....

No personal criticism of anyone who likes the comfort zone but you could have made that 10 year return in the past few months


If you were ten years older - what investments would you use to help protect your portfolio gains ?
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2 users thanked MartynC for this post.
Guest on 17/02/2021(UTC), Jesse M on 17/02/2021(UTC)
Bvlp
Posted: 16 February 2021 21:02:25(UTC)
#128

Joined: 17/05/2018(UTC)
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Bulldog Drummond;153107 wrote:
10 years return in the 50% to 70% return range strikes me as absolutely pathetic and I wouldn't touch any of them. I know that I am in a minority (maybe of 1 here) here but I think that the only people making money out of these are the managers

But whatever makes you comfortable....

No personal criticism of anyone who likes the comfort zone but you could have made that 10 year return in the past few months


https://ibb.co/QFrxxx9

The last ten years are irrelevant, it's the next ten that count. Ten years ago I would have been describing what a dog SMT was and how great CGT has been...
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Tim D on 16/02/2021(UTC), SF100 on 16/02/2021(UTC), Guest on 17/02/2021(UTC), Monty Claret on 17/02/2021(UTC)
Bulldog Drummond
Posted: 16 February 2021 21:08:20(UTC)
#130

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MartynC;153109 wrote:
Bulldog Drummond;153107 wrote:
10 years return in the 50% to 70% return range strikes me as absolutely pathetic and I wouldn't touch any of them. I know that I am in a minority (maybe of 1 here) here but I think that the only people making money out of these are the managers

But whatever makes you comfortable....

No personal criticism of anyone who likes the comfort zone but you could have made that 10 year return in the past few months


If you were ten years older - what investments would you use to help protect your portfolio gains ?



If I were 10 years older I doubt I would care very much but if I still had my marbles I would still be risk on
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Easyrider
Posted: 16 February 2021 21:32:29(UTC)
#157

Joined: 09/11/2020(UTC)
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Can someone please explain the attraction of PNL to me?
It's up 36.7% over 5 years whereas LifeStrategy 60/40 is up 63.3% and its OCF is 0.9% compared with 0.22 for LS 60/40.
I don't get it.
Am I missing something?
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Tyrion Lannister on 16/02/2021(UTC)
Bulldog Drummond
Posted: 16 February 2021 21:47:23(UTC)
#160

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Easyrider;153120 wrote:
Can someone please explain the attraction of PNL to me?
It's up 36.7% over 5 years whereas LifeStrategy 60/40 is up 63.3% and its OCF is 0.9% compared with 0.22 for LS 60/40.
I don't get it.
Am I missing something?



I think you just have a lot of posters here who not to put too fine a point on it are not in the first flush of youth and CGT/PNL are the equivalent of putting fifty quid notes in socks under the bed
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Tim D
Posted: 16 February 2021 21:48:15(UTC)
#154

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Bulldog Drummond;153107 wrote:
10 years return in the 50% to 70% return range strikes me as absolutely pathetic and I wouldn't touch any of them. I know that I am in a minority (maybe of 1 here) here but I think that the only people making money out of these are the managers.


Depends what you're comparing them with really.

Over the last 5 years (according to trustnet), annualised total return...

CGT has done 7.9%pa
Ruffer 7.8%pa
PNL 6.5%pa

Compared to SMT's 44.7%pa that is indeed small beer.

But for those of us looking to "bank" some of the profits we've made on the growthy, equity parts of our PFs into something more hopefully stable, they're still considerably more attractive than traditional "safe havens", if you believe the managers can deliver on the wealth preservation aspect when it comes to the crunch. Over the same period:

IA Sterling Strategic Bond has done 4.9%pa
IA Global Bonds 4.0%pa
IA UK Gilts 3.7%pa
IA Money Market (ie "cash") 0.3%pa

I seem to remember another recent thread on cash substitutes/alternatives... and there, some folks were freaking out not that PNL/CGT/RICA were low-return plodders but that they were far *too* risky/volatile despite them delivering an order of magnitude better returns than cash.

But ultimately everyone has to choose for themselves where on the risk/reward spectrum they want to place what proportion of their assets. And everyone's different.
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Robin on 16/02/2021(UTC), Andrew59 on 16/02/2021(UTC), J Ross on 16/02/2021(UTC), Hyndford on 16/02/2021(UTC), Guest on 17/02/2021(UTC), Guest on 17/02/2021(UTC), Monty Claret on 17/02/2021(UTC), Jeff Liddiard on 17/02/2021(UTC), npf on 17/02/2021(UTC), Jesse M on 25/02/2022(UTC)
Robin
Posted: 16 February 2021 21:49:09(UTC)
#159

Joined: 06/07/2009(UTC)
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Easyrider;153120 wrote:
Can someone please explain the attraction of PNL to me?
It's up 36.7% over 5 years whereas LifeStrategy 60/40 is up 63.3% and its OCF is 0.9% compared with 0.22 for LS 60/40.
I don't get it.
Am I missing something?




I'm unsure when PNL last nudges anything like 60% equity. PNL has stated purpose of protecting value of shares in the Trust. I do not think LS 60/40 is about wealth preservation. I can understand why some who have accumulated a significant enough pot so as not to be put off by potential high drawdown might shun PNL, but to many who want to protect their finances without the risk of significant loss PNL is a perfectly viable option in a balanced portfolio.
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6 users thanked Robin for this post.
Tim D on 16/02/2021(UTC), Andrew59 on 16/02/2021(UTC), J Ross on 16/02/2021(UTC), Easyrider on 16/02/2021(UTC), Guest on 17/02/2021(UTC), Trudy Scrumptious on 17/02/2021(UTC)
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