Funds Insider - Opening the door to funds

Welcome to the Citywire Funds Insider Forums, where members share investment ideas and discuss everything to do with their money.

You'll need to log in or set up an account to start new discussions or reply to existing ones. See you inside!

Notification

Icon
Error

Legal & General
Hilda Ogden
Posted: 07 February 2025 16:36:19(UTC)

Joined: 31/07/2023(UTC)
Posts: 883

Thanks: 747 times
Was thanked: 1735 time(s) in 629 post(s)
L.P.;333589 wrote:
Well that little kick up in the share price this morning didn’t last too long. I saw +11% at one point and now struggling to finish the day up at all.

Quite. It's a perennial disappointment L&G. I keep thinking there's better times ahead for the share price but it just never seems to happen. Good job I hold it for the income.
3 users thanked Hilda Ogden for this post.
Busy doing nothing on 07/02/2025(UTC), ANDREW FOSTER on 07/02/2025(UTC), Micawber on 10/02/2025(UTC)
Wheresthejam .
Posted: 07 February 2025 17:26:34(UTC)

Joined: 27/01/2025(UTC)
Posts: 54

Hilda Ogden;333591 wrote:
L.P.;333589 wrote:
Well that little kick up in the share price this morning didn’t last too long. I saw +11% at one point and now struggling to finish the day up at all.

Quite. It's a perennial disappointment L&G. I keep thinking there's better times ahead for the share price but it just never seems to happen. Good job I hold it for the income.



It's been a great stock to swing trade on! I continue to hold a core position of 10K shares @ 227p which I've averaged down from ~235.

I suspect the "bottom" of the stock will move from 215 to 225p based on the latest news but no guarantees.

MarkSp
Posted: 07 February 2025 19:07:13(UTC)

Joined: 02/02/2020(UTC)
Posts: 2,176

When u get your calculator out, the deal delivers little but loses 20% of future US Protection revenues

LGEN needs growth and it hasn't got it.

You could have got stock in the opening auction at 266 and sold them for 240 eight hours later.

thats pretty transformative.... wine into water
Wheresthejam .
Posted: 07 February 2025 20:01:35(UTC)

Joined: 27/01/2025(UTC)
Posts: 54

MarkSp;333599 wrote:
When u get your calculator out, the deal delivers little but loses 20% of future US Protection revenues

LGEN needs growth and it hasn't got it.

You could have got stock in the opening auction at 266 and sold them for 240 eight hours later.

thats pretty transformative.... wine into water


From the announcement link posted earlier:-

"L&G therefore expects to return the equivalent of c. 40% of its market cap to shareholders over 2025-2027 through a combination of dividends and buybacks. The remaining net proceeds from the Transaction would be retained and invested to support the delivery of the Group's growth strategy."

I take it you are not a believer in their growth strategy then? :-)

I'm assuming they are looking to build on the recent investment in Taurus, and use the war chest to continue to expand their international portfolio/ US real estate.


1 user thanked Wheresthejam . for this post.
Phil 2 on 08/02/2025(UTC)
MarkSp
Posted: 08 February 2025 10:02:32(UTC)

Joined: 02/02/2020(UTC)
Posts: 2,176

Wheresthejam .;333602 wrote:
MarkSp;333599 wrote:
When u get your calculator out, the deal delivers little but loses 20% of future US Protection revenues

LGEN needs growth and it hasn't got it.

You could have got stock in the opening auction at 266 and sold them for 240 eight hours later.

thats pretty transformative.... wine into water


From the announcement link posted earlier:-

"L&G therefore expects to return the equivalent of c. 40% of its market cap to shareholders over 2025-2027 through a combination of dividends and buybacks. The remaining net proceeds from the Transaction would be retained and invested to support the delivery of the Group's growth strategy."

I take it you are not a believer in their growth strategy then? :-)

I'm assuming they are looking to build on the recent investment in Taurus, and use the war chest to continue to expand their international portfolio/ US real estate.




If you look at their current divi and their 2024-7 commitments, factor in the buy back that is committed reducing the shares that will be available for the div pool I think there is an additional 2-3p over the current commitment and they are minus the US Protection business and 20% of the US PRT futures

This looks more like a financial game and managing the solvency ratio than anything that is business "transformational"

The three positives for the Sp
the partner is looking to buy 5% of LGEN in the open market
there is an implied valuation on the US PRT business that you might be able to read across
there will be approx 7% shares reduced from the BB

i don't think that whether the div is 20.6 or 21.4p will make a lot of difference

I was all excited and then I got to the core question..................................... AND?

So I took the money and watched the balloon deflate.
2 users thanked MarkSp for this post.
ANDREW FOSTER on 08/02/2025(UTC), Sheerman on 08/02/2025(UTC)
Harry Gloom
Posted: 08 February 2025 10:48:51(UTC)

Joined: 01/12/2022(UTC)
Posts: 389

Thanks: 254 times
Was thanked: 1025 time(s) in 279 post(s)
Before I retired at the end of last year, a colleague who is also due to retire soon told me has was looking at buying LGEN shares with his pension TFLS for the dividends by opening an account is his wife's name and she would draw the dividends to within her tax allowance so it would all be tax free each year.

So, we sat down and I plotted out the last 5 years performance of LGEN with dividends vs VUAG (S&P500) taking the same money from each, the LGEN dividends only and drawing down capital from VUAG.

The difference in final capital value was crap for LGEN vs VUAG.

I really don't get the attraction for high dividend paying stocks and much prefer total return and capital drawdown. Even in a market crash like 2022, there is a risk dividends will be reduced, or even if they do continue, in the long run, total return wins.

Divis are not free money.
2 users thanked Harry Gloom for this post.
Dexi on 08/02/2025(UTC), Rookie Investor on 08/02/2025(UTC)
Dexi
Posted: 08 February 2025 11:34:38(UTC)

Joined: 03/04/2018(UTC)
Posts: 1,749

Last time I looked , LGEN seemed about the same as the FTSE 100 for total return , so why not buy a FTSE ETF ? - same result but more diversified with less stock-specific risk .
Rookie Investor
Posted: 08 February 2025 11:42:43(UTC)

Joined: 09/12/2020(UTC)
Posts: 2,081

Normally, insurance companies should do well, i.e. outperform the market, during rising/high interest rates. Don't see much out-performance here for LGEN. Suggests a poor business.

Don't get trapped with this "free dividends" fallacy. Focus should be on the business. Without looking in detail (insurers are complex businesses to understand and value), seems given lack of performance during this recent rate hiking cycle, LGEN is one to avoid.
MarkSp
Posted: 08 February 2025 13:16:23(UTC)

Joined: 02/02/2020(UTC)
Posts: 2,176

Dexi;333637 wrote:
Last time I looked , LGEN seemed about the same as the FTSE 100 for total return , so why not buy a FTSE ETF ? - same result but more diversified with less stock-specific risk .


5 Year TR

1.68 to 6.9 on the FTSE100

Not close

i wiill call anyone a liar who says they can tell if LGEN or MNG/PHNX are cheap or expensive as I don't believe anyone on here can interpret the accounts or know whether the actuarial assumptions are good/bad. the accounts are fog


it is very obvious that the BoE is getting nervous about the pension Risk Transfer market and the concentration in that. i have a feeling they will step in.
1 user thanked MarkSp for this post.
ANDREW FOSTER on 08/02/2025(UTC)
johan kill
Posted: 08 February 2025 14:24:40(UTC)

Joined: 07/02/2025(UTC)
Posts: 3

L&G’s PE ratio and dividend yield certainly make it an interesting consideration, especially in an uncertain market. With inflation concerns still lingering, many investors are looking for strong dividend payers as a hedge. If you're after diversification, sector-specific ETFs or income-focused funds could be worth considering—something like Vanguard FTSE UK Equity Income might provide broader exposure while still capturing companies like L&G.

For those with a long-term outlook, real estate investments can also offer a solid hedge against inflation. The Dagenham property market, for example, has seen growing investor interest due to its strong rental demand and ongoing regeneration projects. Some investors diversify by allocating part of their portfolio to income-generating property assets alongside equities.

Has anyone here considered blending stock market investments with real estate for a balanced approach?
34 Pages«Previous page31323334Next page
+ Reply to discussion

Markets

Other markets