Funds Insider - Opening the door to funds

Welcome to the Citywire Funds Insider Forums, where members share investment ideas and discuss everything to do with their money.

You'll need to log in or set up an account to start new discussions or reply to existing ones. See you inside!

Notification

Icon
Error

Have you ever gone: I've got enough and so am getting out of equities?
North Star
Posted: 11 December 2023 12:07:41(UTC)
#9

Joined: 22/05/2014(UTC)
Posts: 438

Thanks: 2301 times
Was thanked: 675 time(s) in 285 post(s)
Hilda Ogden;289210 wrote:
North Star;289209 wrote:
Keith Cobby;289204 wrote:
Nope. Agree with Hilda, I'll keep a couple of years cash and then stay in FCIT, SAIN, BNKR (plus JGGI) etc. They have been around a very long time, kept going in all situations, throw out sustainable dividends, offer inflation protection. I'll expire holding FCIT!


I sold all my BNKR last week and reinvested in other global trusts and OEIC's. I can't understand why BNKR has under-performed so much over the past two years. FCIT not done much better either.

I'm having serious doubts about SAIN too. It's done about half as well as JGGI the last few years with about half the yield. Not great.


Having criticised BNKR & FCIT I have say I'm very pleased that ATST have got their act together in the last few years with managers Willis Towers Watson investment strategy paying-off well.
IMHO there's no point in global trusts just being global trackers (that's being done effectively by other cheaper funds). The managers need to work for their money and find the next generation of winners.
1 user thanked North Star for this post.
Hilda Ogden on 11/12/2023(UTC)
Sara G
Posted: 11 December 2023 12:39:54(UTC)
#13

Joined: 07/05/2015(UTC)
Posts: 4,046

Thanks: 13084 times
Was thanked: 16869 time(s) in 3515 post(s)
I suppose it depends on what you're getting into having gotten out of equities. In most cases you'll be swapping one risk for another. Cash, for example, is almost certain to underperform over a long time horizon, and if higher inflation becomes the norm, then what seems like enough now, can quickly erode.

Also, how do we know how much is enough, when life can throw so many curve balls? It isn't just market crashes that can derail our best laid plans.

Personally, I will always hold equities (and private equity) in order to benefit from compounded growth over time, while keeping sufficient liquidity to act as a cash buffer / dry powder to take advantage of market falls. Having said that, my equities exposure is currently pretty low for various reasons, and I'm building up fixed income exposure in the SIPP. I will increase equities again when I can.

On the global dividend ITs... JGGI looks better than the rest currently, but is that because it's partly become a growth fund and pays dividends out of capital?
9 users thanked Sara G for this post.
North Star on 11/12/2023(UTC), MBA MBA on 11/12/2023(UTC), William P on 11/12/2023(UTC), Mostly Retired on 11/12/2023(UTC), Jay P on 11/12/2023(UTC), John Hope on 12/12/2023(UTC), Kevin Crane on 16/12/2023(UTC), Tim Dr on 24/12/2023(UTC), kim shillinglaw on 30/12/2023(UTC)
Thrugelmir
Posted: 11 December 2023 12:40:58(UTC)
#14

Joined: 01/06/2012(UTC)
Posts: 5,333

Thanks: 3258 times
Was thanked: 7896 time(s) in 3271 post(s)
MBA MBA;289189 wrote:
generate an income of £30-40k pa between the two of us without taking any meaningful risk.



Will this income be inflation linked i.e. maintain it's real terms buying power? Does it meet your personal objectives, i.e. fund future plans?
1 user thanked Thrugelmir for this post.
MBA MBA on 11/12/2023(UTC)
You have to change your life
Posted: 11 December 2023 12:51:54(UTC)
#15

Joined: 17/11/2021(UTC)
Posts: 2,194

Thanks: 730 times
Was thanked: 1798 time(s) in 972 post(s)
A lot of "market wisdom" was based on making your investments/pensions last your lifetime. That was before they became the biggest assets we could pass on.

I'm going to be in the accumulation stage to my last day but I quite like making money for its own sake.

6 users thanked You have to change your life for this post.
MBA MBA on 11/12/2023(UTC), Chalky W on 11/12/2023(UTC), Dentmaster on 11/12/2023(UTC), Maloney on 12/12/2023(UTC), Timbo Wilts on 16/12/2023(UTC), Nigel A on 17/12/2023(UTC)
Harry Gloom
Posted: 11 December 2023 13:01:57(UTC)
#16

Joined: 01/12/2022(UTC)
Posts: 391

Thanks: 259 times
Was thanked: 1031 time(s) in 281 post(s)
I would recommend testing different asset allocations in a retirement cashflow modelling software program to stress test it against historical market & inflation data (with some assumptions), this can give a level of confidence if a particular asset mix will meet expected retirement needs. or, if you don't have access then perhaps see an IFA
3 users thanked Harry Gloom for this post.
Sara G on 11/12/2023(UTC), MBA MBA on 11/12/2023(UTC), kim shillinglaw on 30/12/2023(UTC)
Sara G
Posted: 11 December 2023 13:08:29(UTC)
#17

Joined: 07/05/2015(UTC)
Posts: 4,046

Thanks: 13084 times
Was thanked: 16869 time(s) in 3515 post(s)
Harry Gloom;289225 wrote:
I would recommend testing different asset allocations in a retirement cashflow modelling software program to stress test it against historical market & inflation data (with some assumptions), this can give a level of confidence if a particular asset mix will meet expected retirement needs. or, if you don't have access then perhaps see an IFA


For those who have not discovered it, this site is useful for back-testing asset allocations and various portfolios, such as Golden Butterfly, Permanent Portfolio etc.:

https://portfoliocharts.com/

Bear in mind, however that it's entirely possible that we are in the midst of a structural shift that could mean that the next 40 years look very different to the last 40. Going back 50 years to include the 1970's may offer some assurance.
4 users thanked Sara G for this post.
Thrugelmir on 11/12/2023(UTC), MBA MBA on 11/12/2023(UTC), Greylocks on 16/12/2023(UTC), Nigel A on 17/12/2023(UTC)
Anthony French
Posted: 11 December 2023 13:08:39(UTC)
#19

Joined: 09/09/2018(UTC)
Posts: 9,141

Thanks: 151 times
Was thanked: 1915 time(s) in 1337 post(s)
IFA's don't recommend IT's, I guess they would say that's because they can go
to a discount, I guess I would say it's because there is nothing in them
for them.
So if u want to own IT's maybe best to save your money.
Just my opinion.



1 user thanked Anthony French for this post.
North Star on 11/12/2023(UTC)
L.P.
Posted: 11 December 2023 14:13:39(UTC)
#10

Joined: 14/07/2023(UTC)
Posts: 673

Thanks: 1672 times
Was thanked: 2060 time(s) in 545 post(s)
Keith Cobby;289204 wrote:
Nope. Agree with Hilda, I'll keep a couple of years cash and then stay in FCIT, SAIN, BNKR (plus JGGI) etc. They have been around a very long time, kept going in all situations, throw out sustainable dividends, offer inflation protection. I'll expire holding FCIT!



You might have to elaborate on that Keith!

Bankers has underperformed massively against a global tracker over the last 10 years (200% vs 115% approx) and that’s with gearing and dividends reinvested. What is the point ?
3 users thanked L.P. for this post.
North Star on 11/12/2023(UTC), Kevin Crane on 17/12/2023(UTC), Alex Peard on 18/12/2023(UTC)
Thrugelmir
Posted: 11 December 2023 14:15:51(UTC)
#18

Joined: 01/06/2012(UTC)
Posts: 5,333

Thanks: 3258 times
Was thanked: 7896 time(s) in 3271 post(s)
Sara G;289226 wrote:


Bear in mind, however that it's entirely possible that we are in the midst of a structural shift that could mean that the next 40 years look very different to the last 40. Going back 50 years to include the 1970's may offer some assurance.


Was reading at the weekend that 42% of the increased profitability of S&P companies since 1981 has been generated from decreasing interest rates and lower corporate taxation. US equities in the decades prior to the 1980's didn't outperform the return on Treasury bonds for periods of time either.

When you are accustomed to something being normal can be a challenge to take a step back and consider at why there might be change on the way.
5 users thanked Thrugelmir for this post.
North Star on 11/12/2023(UTC), Guest on 11/12/2023(UTC), Kevin Crane on 17/12/2023(UTC), Nigel A on 17/12/2023(UTC), kim shillinglaw on 30/12/2023(UTC)
Keith Cobby
Posted: 11 December 2023 14:27:39(UTC)
#20

Joined: 07/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 5,064

Thanks: 5966 times
Was thanked: 12448 time(s) in 3858 post(s)
Agree that Bankers has been disappointing recently and, as we all know, a recent drop in performance affects cumulative performance. Bankers has a lower proportion in the US than most of the other global trusts. In my experience there have been times when the large global trusts have been ahead and behind each other, for example ATST has had a good run recently. Obviously, your entry point is a big factor but I think holding for the long term often smooths out performance. Of course, if you are not prepared for periods of underperformance against the index (currently US heavy), then your holdings must reflect this.
6 users thanked Keith Cobby for this post.
Jay P on 11/12/2023(UTC), L.P. on 11/12/2023(UTC), Guest on 11/12/2023(UTC), North Star on 11/12/2023(UTC), Mostly Retired on 11/12/2023(UTC), Kaufman on 12/12/2023(UTC)
5 PagesPrevious page1234Next page»
+ Reply to discussion

Markets

Other markets