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Posted: 14 February 2024 17:08:11(UTC)
#57

Joined: 09/12/2020(UTC)
Posts: 2,088
Robert D;296225 wrote:
Dexi;296222 wrote:
Would Starmer et al. make things better though ?
Would higher taxes and even more public spending improve the economy - no .
Could they stop the boats - no .
Maybe those in the public sector will do a bit better with more generous pay deals .



Higher taxes or closing tax loopholes on the wealthy - yes. Sunak's tax returns last week showed he paid a 22.8% tax rate on earnings of £2.3 million. There are many thousands like him. How is that fair on ordinary middle income 40% tax payers?

Government spending on public services - yes. The economy will not thrive and grow without a properly functioning state.

The "boats" are irrelevant and is just a poitiical ploy to appease the Conservative right. Very few illegal migrants arrive by boat





The country will also not thrive if the government doesn't tax the bottom 99%, because otherwise you will have higher inflation without growth and less workforce participation.
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ANDREW FOSTER
Posted: 14 February 2024 17:44:22(UTC)
#40

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Thrugelmir;296223 wrote:
ANDREW FOSTER;296213 wrote:


Ending 'Green' charges on energy and generally ending Net Zero targets as impossible and unaffordable.

.


Doing nothing is not an option though. Only unaffordable in terms of priorities.


Exactly why isn't it an option?

What precisiely will happen if we don't do it?

China, Asia, USA aren't doing Net Zero, and their emissions outputs utterly dwarf the UK into insignificance. So how is doing nothing an option for them and not us?

Discuss... ;-)
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2 users thanked ANDREW FOSTER for this post.
SF100 on 14/02/2024(UTC), Guest on 15/02/2024(UTC)
ANDREW FOSTER
Posted: 14 February 2024 17:48:15(UTC)
#43

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Robert D;296217 wrote:
Blimey, there are some strange folk on here.

They want national unity but are voting Reform, a divisive party.




Exactly which Reform policies are you having trouble with...?
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Thrugelmir
Posted: 14 February 2024 17:49:36(UTC)
#58

Joined: 01/06/2012(UTC)
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Only a poltitical activist would describe 40% taxpayers as being middle income.
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3 users thanked Thrugelmir for this post.
SSJ on 14/02/2024(UTC), Guest on 15/02/2024(UTC), Peter1598753 on 18/02/2024(UTC)
Keith Cobby
Posted: 14 February 2024 19:04:24(UTC)
#35

Joined: 07/03/2012(UTC)
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Toadfish;296231 wrote:
Keith Cobby;296199 wrote:
Anyone intending to vote for Labour shouldn't get their hopes up. The country's problems seem very intractable and nothing Starmer has said gives any expectation that he has any more idea than the Tories. As we have seen, Labour has trouble with militant Islam and this will not be an easy issue to deal with given that Starmer's wife is Jewish. I think we need a government of national unity but in the absence of such, will be voting Reform.


Don't be surprised if Starmer doesn't stay PM for long, there are whisperings in the party that the corbynistas are simply bidding their time and waiting for Starmer to win the election. Once in No.10 they'll challenge his leadership, oust him and put one of their own on the throne. Don't think it could happen, look at the Tories...


I wouldn't be surprised, whenever I see him interviewed he never looks like he's enjoying the job (like Brown didn't), clearly not a natural politician (like Blair). It's going to be very difficult enough without the distraction of mutinous Muslims!
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3 users thanked Keith Cobby for this post.
Thrugelmir on 14/02/2024(UTC), Guest on 15/02/2024(UTC), Toadfish on 16/02/2024(UTC)
SSJ
Posted: 14 February 2024 21:07:19(UTC)
#48

Joined: 13/09/2010(UTC)
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Robert D;296225 wrote:
Higher taxes or closing tax loopholes on the wealthy - yes. Sunak's tax returns last week showed he paid a 22.8% tax rate on earnings of £2.3 million. There are many thousands like him. How is that fair on ordinary middle income 40% tax payers?

Sunak paid up to 45% on his salary and interest, and 37.5% on his dividends, i.e. more than "ordinary middle income 40% tax payers" pay on their income. He also paid the same capital gains tax rate as "ordinary middle income 40% tax payers" do if they have capital gains.

(It's all there in the same data from which you calculated 22.8%.)
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5 users thanked SSJ for this post.
Thrugelmir on 14/02/2024(UTC), Tim D on 14/02/2024(UTC), Guest on 15/02/2024(UTC), Toadfish on 16/02/2024(UTC), monkshood on 23/05/2024(UTC)
Thrugelmir
Posted: 14 February 2024 21:18:46(UTC)
#36

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Keith Cobby;296278 wrote:
Toadfish;296231 wrote:
Keith Cobby;296199 wrote:
Anyone intending to vote for Labour shouldn't get their hopes up. The country's problems seem very intractable and nothing Starmer has said gives any expectation that he has any more idea than the Tories. As we have seen, Labour has trouble with militant Islam and this will not be an easy issue to deal with given that Starmer's wife is Jewish. I think we need a government of national unity but in the absence of such, will be voting Reform.


Don't be surprised if Starmer doesn't stay PM for long, there are whisperings in the party that the corbynistas are simply bidding their time and waiting for Starmer to win the election. Once in No.10 they'll challenge his leadership, oust him and put one of their own on the throne. Don't think it could happen, look at the Tories...


I wouldn't be surprised, whenever I see him interviewed he never looks like he's enjoying the job (like Brown didn't), clearly not a natural politician (like Blair). It's going to be very difficult enough without the distraction of mutinous Muslims!


Keeping Rayner from opening her mouth will be a challenge.
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4 users thanked Thrugelmir for this post.
ANDREW FOSTER on 14/02/2024(UTC), Jay P on 14/02/2024(UTC), Guest on 15/02/2024(UTC), Toadfish on 16/02/2024(UTC)
SSJ
Posted: 14 February 2024 21:33:52(UTC)
#34

Joined: 13/09/2010(UTC)
Posts: 512

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Toadfish;296231 wrote:
Keith Cobby;296199 wrote:
Anyone intending to vote for Labour shouldn't get their hopes up. The country's problems seem very intractable and nothing Starmer has said gives any expectation that he has any more idea than the Tories. As we have seen, Labour has trouble with militant Islam and this will not be an easy issue to deal with given that Starmer's wife is Jewish. I think we need a government of national unity but in the absence of such, will be voting Reform.


Don't be surprised if Starmer doesn't stay PM for long, there are whisperings in the party that the corbynistas are simply bidding their time and waiting for Starmer to win the election. Once in No.10 they'll challenge his leadership, oust him and put one of their own on the throne. Don't think it could happen, look at the Tories...

Agree. The early warning signs will be Sadiq Khan and Andy Burnham standing in Parliamentary by-elections.
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1 user thanked SSJ for this post.
Toadfish on 16/02/2024(UTC)
ANDREW FOSTER
Posted: 14 February 2024 22:23:13(UTC)
#47

Joined: 23/07/2019(UTC)
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Robert D;296225 wrote:

The "boats" are irrelevant and is just a poitiical ploy to appease the Conservative right. Very few illegal migrants arrive by boat



About 30,000.

Or roughly 10% of all migrants.

10% too many.... Cancel the asylum system an deport the whole lot. Job done.
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5 users thanked ANDREW FOSTER for this post.
Jay P on 14/02/2024(UTC), Guest on 15/02/2024(UTC), Dexi on 15/02/2024(UTC), stephen_s on 15/02/2024(UTC), Paul Whitnall on 23/02/2024(UTC)
Robert D
Posted: 14 February 2024 23:31:41(UTC)
#49

Joined: 06/11/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,482
SSJ;296293 wrote:
Robert D;296225 wrote:
Higher taxes or closing tax loopholes on the wealthy - yes. Sunak's tax returns last week showed he paid a 22.8% tax rate on earnings of £2.3 million. There are many thousands like him. How is that fair on ordinary middle income 40% tax payers?

Sunak paid up to 45% on his salary and interest, and 37.5% on his dividends, i.e. more than "ordinary middle income 40% tax payers" pay on their income. He also paid the same capital gains tax rate as "ordinary middle income 40% tax payers" do if they have capital gains.

(It's all there in the same data from which you calculated 22.8%.)



He paid around £500,000 tax on circa £2.3 million income, a tax rate of 22.8.%. The figures are easily available.

An unelected almost billionaire Prime Minister who will never have to deal with the terrible public services that his party has wrought on our country doesn’t sit well with me.

I find it hard to believe that anyone can have empathy for a PM in charge of a country in such dire straits when he will be on a first class flight off to California as soon as he's lost the election
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