Funds Insider - Opening the door to funds

Welcome to the Citywire Funds Insider Forums, where members share investment ideas and discuss everything to do with their money.

You'll need to log in or set up an account to start new discussions or reply to existing ones. See you inside!

Notification

Icon
Error

Politics and Economics-2017 Election
Jon Snow
Posted: 09 June 2017 23:32:27(UTC)

Joined: 02/03/2014(UTC)
Posts: 1,172

Prof Eman
Posted: 10 June 2017 13:54:20(UTC)

Joined: 08/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 480

Just want to clarify my comment on Trickle down.
We have the highest number of billionaires in London, of any city.
One would expect the trickle down effect to be significant.
Regrettably not. Why, because most of the wealth is off shore. Some estimates put it at around 130 trillion. If all that money was on shore, would we need austerity?
I wonder.
So is reducing corporation tax a way of helping to solve our problems?
King Lodos
Posted: 10 June 2017 23:07:31(UTC)

Joined: 05/01/2016(UTC)
Posts: 11,046

Thanks: 6166 times
Was thanked: 30411 time(s) in 8333 post(s)
Prof Eman;47805 wrote:
Just want to clarify my comment on Trickle down.
We have the highest number of billionaires in London, of any city.
One would expect the trickle down effect to be significant.


The problem with 'trickle down' is most people who talk about it don't know how to define it, let alone how to measure it..

London's full of Russian and Arab billionaires spending money like billionaires do (and if you understand the multiplier effect, for example, you'll appreciate how industries built around these people do prop up the whole economy) .. In brief: it's better to have them spending money here than in Monte Carlo.

Take for example the effect of companies like Google and Amazon relocating to Ireland to enjoy tax breaks .. So Ireland aren't getting billions in tax, but how fast has Ireland's economy been growing? Well it managed 26.3% in 2015 .. Better they're there than in Paris or Berlin .. Also realise, unless you want your offshore wealth to disappear to inflation, it's most likely in government and corporate bonds anyway – this is the money our governments rely on when they run out of tax dollars to spend – this is where the money for the bulk of Corbyn's plans would've come from .. Keynesianism doesn't work without that endless supply of debt.
1 user thanked King Lodos for this post.
jvl on 12/06/2017(UTC)
Prof Eman
Posted: 11 June 2017 12:43:01(UTC)

Joined: 08/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 480

King Lodos
Without attempting to define trickle down, it is obviously not working when during austerity the rich get richer and the poor get poorer (consider the number of food banks and their meals served)
As regards spending patterns
-the billionaires do not live here permanently but spend a lot of their time abroad jetting around in their private jets. The poor are here all the time spending any money they have all in this country all the time. The propensity to spend in this country of the poor is much higher than that of the billionaires. They also impact on the velocity of circulation, as they spend all their money immediately e.g. benefits.
- the billionaires have savings and money off shore, as well as the ability to pick and chose which country to buy things, so the amount of their spending is questionable.
-many of them prefer Monte Carlo to Britain
-Also the billionaires distort the housing market, especially London and South East driving up prices, making it difficult for Britons to buy property.
As regards Companies moving abroad, Brexit is an issue. Secondly wages abroad are an issue, cheaper in many countries of the EU than here. There is more to Cos moving abroad than just tax breaks, especially considering the number of tax havens available to them.
jvl
Posted: 12 June 2017 08:05:03(UTC)

Joined: 01/04/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,125

You're getting far more quality replies than you deserve for such obviously one-sided thought.

I'd be willing to bet that you'd pass less than 10% of them on to your "students" and, even then, only as a sap to make it appear that you're being fair.

Radicalising the naive young disaffected...
Alan Selwood
Posted: 12 June 2017 11:28:58(UTC)

Joined: 17/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,379

Prof Eman;47823 wrote:
King Lodos

.......As regards Companies moving abroad, Brexit is an issue. Secondly wages abroad are an issue, cheaper in many countries of the EU than here. There is more to Cos moving abroad than just tax breaks, especially considering the number of tax havens available to them.


Wages abroad are cheaper or dearer or the same as here, depending on which EU country you are referring to.

Another factor is regulation and taxation, which has led to many French people coming here to work or set up businesses, since the regulations and tax in France are significantly more off-putting to business than they are here (this comparison applies only while Corbyn is not in charge).
Prof Eman
Posted: 13 June 2017 01:58:14(UTC)

Joined: 08/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 480

Jvi
In line with the latest social media activity-
A lot of people are waking up to the fact that trickle down is a BIG CON of the GOVErnment, and do not consider it very punny.
What I teach my students is to look at facts and data and then interpret it in a non blinkered beliefs way. That sort of activity is left to some papers and mass media outlets.
Time you woke up.
King Lodos
Posted: 13 June 2017 02:18:21(UTC)

Joined: 05/01/2016(UTC)
Posts: 11,046

Thanks: 6166 times
Was thanked: 30411 time(s) in 8333 post(s)
Prof Eman;47823 wrote:
King Lodos
Without attempting to define trickle down, it is obviously not working when during austerity the rich get richer and the poor get poorer (consider the number of food banks and their meals served)
As regards spending patterns
-the billionaires do not live here permanently but spend a lot of their time abroad jetting around in their private jets. The poor are here all the time spending any money they have all in this country all the time. The propensity to spend in this country of the poor is much higher than that of the billionaires. They also impact on the velocity of circulation, as they spend all their money immediately e.g. benefits.
- the billionaires have savings and money off shore, as well as the ability to pick and chose which country to buy things, so the amount of their spending is questionable.
-many of them prefer Monte Carlo to Britain
-Also the billionaires distort the housing market, especially London and South East driving up prices, making it difficult for Britons to buy property.
As regards Companies moving abroad, Brexit is an issue. Secondly wages abroad are an issue, cheaper in many countries of the EU than here. There is more to Cos moving abroad than just tax breaks, especially considering the number of tax havens available to them.


Well the way we're dealing with sluggish economic growth at this phase in the debt cycle is with QE.

And no one really knows if this works yet .. It was inspired by Japan, and the likes of Bernanke argued that inflating asset prices would inflate the economy .. I think the jury's out on that – but of course one effect is asset owners (generally wealthier) get wealthier .. But this isn't to be confused with austerity.

Austerity usually hits the poor the hardest – but then we can't forget the upside of 20 years of capitalism is nearly a doubling in real wages for most of the world's population (with the only group getting slightly poorer since the 80s being your stereotypical Trump and Brexit voters – Developed world working classes).

https://cdn1.benzinga.com/files/u81483/gobalization.png
2 users thanked King Lodos for this post.
jvl on 13/06/2017(UTC), Jon Snow on 13/06/2017(UTC)
sandid3
Posted: 13 June 2017 03:27:41(UTC)

Joined: 18/02/2013(UTC)
Posts: 651

Prof Eman;46953 wrote:
A student asked me a question, and I could not think of an immediate answer. It was-
Why should I vote and if so how?

I think events have answered the original question.
jvl
Posted: 13 June 2017 08:09:53(UTC)

Joined: 01/04/2016(UTC)
Posts: 1,125

Prof Eman;47878 wrote:
Jvi
What I teach my students is to look at facts and data and then interpret it in a non blinkered beliefs way. That sort of activity is left to some papers and mass media outlets.
Time you woke up.


Time you stopped spamming an investors' forum with disingenuous socialist claptrap, pretending that you were ever reasonably open-minded.

People are wiping the floor with your arguments and you come back for more. I'd be willing to bet that if a bright student ever interpreted the facts in the way that King Lodos has above, you'd mark that student down.

If you're really a professor teaching our young people, it's sad, but not unexpected, to find someone of that persuasion in education. Hopefully as they grow up in the real world and see consequences in action, they'll change their minds. In fact, that's what tends to happen with votes for socialist parties as people get experience and grow older and wiser. Not everyone though...
18 Pages«Previous page1314151617Next page»
+ Reply to discussion

Markets

Other markets